Would you consider this a mild bit

[Gliderider]

http://www.horseloverz.com/Trammell-Reining-Horse-Bit-with-Coppermouth---5-pr-344010.html


Would you consider this a mild bit ? There are just to many bits :huh:

[GrungeEquestrian]

Personally no, with those long shanks and almost straight unbroke bit it would really pull on the horse's bottom jaw with hard hands. The only thing is the copper which some people say is more supple. I though usually only use curbs for western pleasure show class, have very little contact on the bit.

[Palogal]

It's not awful, the harsh thing about it is the straight mouth piece. Broken bits are usually milder. Also the shanks on this one aren't terribly long either, long shanks give more leverage. So I'd say it's not bad.

[AppyLover]

Has a mild mouth but those shanks do put a lot of leverage action into it. What are you looking to get out of the bit you put in your horse's mouth?

[WashingtonBay]

Almost any bit is a mild bit if you can be mild with it. :)

What level horse? It's a curb, obviously, and it's a fixed shank curb, so it's best with a horse who can be ridden on a light or loose rein, and neck reined. Not best for a horse who needs contact or direct rein.

The mullen mouthpiece (it's not straight, it does have curvature and tongue relief) is relatively mild in most mouths and horses with low pallets may prefer it to single joint or port bits.

[Reinmaker]

It's not awful, the harsh thing about it is the straight mouth piece. Broken bits are usually milder. Also the shanks on this one aren't terribly long either, long shanks give more leverage. So I'd say it's not bad.

Wrong. That "straight" mouth piece is considered very mild in a curb bit. It actually isn't straight it is a curved mullen mouth. This is one of the milder curbs available, and works almost entirely on bar pressure with slight tongue pressure.

[Gliderider]

Here are 2 bits I am looking at to buy off members here. My horse right now is riding in a Loose ring French Link Snaffle. He is doing ok with it. So far only rode with it 3 or 4 times. I was using it to polish up on flexing, neck reining etc. Which he flex's very well even at a trot he knows what it is about. Its me that needs to practice really. ;) So far are plan for this horse is mostly trail. He was a cow pony before I got him worked on a Montana ranch for a year I was told. So I am sure he has rode in curb bits before. For trails I like to ride loose reined. I have been told in a curb bit he will be more responsive for neck reining. I have rode other horses in curb bits. Just this horse needs a 5.5 inch solid mouth bit and a 6 inch size for broken mouth. None of my bits fit to try.:doh: So I have been on the search and man there are so many to choose. I am just not sure the French link is enough bit for trial riding if he would get worked up with my Husband riding him. He has never rode a horse with such a bit.

I did just buy a used full cheek snaffle but haven't tried it yet. I just feel over whelmed with all the types of bits and every where I go they tell me different stuff. :huh: I was told a solid mouth with low to medium port in a curb bit is milder then a broken mouth curb bits because they act like nutcrackers. Oh forgot to add this horse just turned 5 this spring.

I am looking at the bottom curb Painted has its a 5.5
http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8538

I was told maybe I should try this type bit for my hubby to trail ride. Because it has some leverage but not a lot just in case he would need it.
http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10596

OOPs I was posting this while you all were posting.

[shewasmyshadow]

I don't really like the bits in those threads. Sorry. Here's something similar to what I put my gelding in and we love it...

http://www.horseloverz.com/Metalab-Stainless-Steel-Argentine-Dog-Bone-Bit---Stainless-Steel---5-38-pr-338940.html

Ours has a little longer shank, but this is very close. This is nice mild bit with some brakes.

[Gliderider]

One of the big problems, I am having getting him bits is he doesn't take the standard size bit. He needs no smaller then a 5.5 inch mouth in his loose ring french link snaffle I had to go with a 6 inch. It is hard to find much of a selection.

[Mandzanita]

Wrong. That "straight" mouth piece is considered very mild in a curb bit. It actually isn't straight it is a curved mullen mouth. This is one of the milder curbs available, and works almost entirely on bar pressure with slight tongue pressure.


You're right, the mullen (especially a curved mullen) has a much gentler action than a jointed mouthpiece and is thought to be pretty darn mild. It works off bar and tongue pressure so, in the right hands, it should actually prove to be pretty comfortable for the horse as long as they don't have an overly thick tongue since that's where the majority of the pressure is applied.

[shewasmyshadow]

Oh, true. I found one similar, but it's pricey...

http://www.horse.com/Sharon-Camarillo-Touch-Plus-Bit-WBR88.html

This one is a 5.5" mouthpiece.

[vicklynn]

After reading about bits the past 2 months, first thing I though was it was an easy bit.
ANY bit can be harsh in the wrong hands.

[3equines]

Before spending money on bits, be sure your legs and seat are completely consistent. And, if the French Link snaffle is really working for you, then just stick with it. I switched to a curb-style bit with the Halfingers because I get better responses with less pressure from them. My Arabian, Taz, will always be a French-link snaffle bit horse. Also, I always give a leg or seat cue before a rein cue, so my horses know which way things are headed.

I have had success transitioning my Haflingers from a French link snaffle to a Kimberwicke type bit, to introduce them to the action of a curb chain and some shank. Sweet P has just graduated from the Kimberwicke to a small-shank Tomb Thumb with a thick, eggbutt-type snaffle over the bars of the mouth and a shank that can rotate out a little (not fixed to the snaffle part). Peach is just moving up to the Kimberwicke.

Depending on what you want, sometimes a leather curb strap is milder than a curb chain. I prefer a curb chain with my Haflingers, it helps keep their heads up with a little pressure from one rein when they are 'drooping' (Haflingers tend to be front-heavy). I still use direct reining to some extent, though it is mostly done with a pinky on one side and forefinger on the other of the same hand, bigger corrections when necessary.

[Gliderider]

3Equines He does ride ok in the French link snaffle and neck reins. I was just wanting a quicker response when I neck rein him. I might just stay in this French link snaffle for a little while yet for practice for myself and him. It won't hurt right even though he had been in a curb before right ? He is great at flexing even at a trot. He also knows how to side pass. There are just so many bits but the few I have rode in before with other horses in the passed I can't find in his size. So I just am feeling overwhelmed. I think you are right I will stay in this bit for now. I am planning on taking lessons in Sept. I guess I could wait and have the riding instructor help pick a curb bit if needed. I have taking lessons with her before and she knows her stuff.

Thank everyone for your input and help. :)

[3equines]

For bits in larger sizes, try this web site and look at their draft bits. If you are not showing in Western, then this Kimberwicke jointed bit is very nice, if you clip the reins to the slot nearest the mouthpiece then you have very mild curb action, and it comes in a 5.5" or larger mouthpiece. http://www.drafttack.com/page22.html

If you are riding Western then I would consider a Myler style bit, you don't need to spend a lot of money, just look for a curb bit with a broken mouthpiece (snaffle) and use the shortest shanks possible for the mildest curb effect.

[WashingtonBay]

3E.... is there some reason you don't like the bit pictures in the OP and are steering toward a kimberwick? Because it would seem to me, that if what gliderider wants is better neckreining cue... then don't you want a solid mouth fixed shank bit? and not a jointed?

A short shank bit or jointed kimberwick would give a pretty muddy neck reining cue.. it's too light, and too - floppy.

Western folk of any stripe, chime in. :)

Also - heavier weighted reins will help give a better neck reining cue, to train, than light ones.

[Reinmaker]

That would be correct WB. Anything broken is going to give more lateral movement. Pure neck reining with little direct rein is best accomplished in a solid mouthpiece with a little bit heavier rein.

However that doesn't mean you can't neck rein in a broken moutpiece or even a snaffle. The foundation of the neck rein and when it should be taught is in a snaffle. Some guys/gals like to transition from the snaffle to tom thumb type mouthpiece. I don't. I like a short shank low port bit with solid mouthpiece with swivel shanks. That way I can still direct rein and neck rein, but am introducing the horse to how I want them to go in the curb. I'll still do a lot of two handed riding but use my hands in a manner that simulates one hand, but gives me more ability to make corrections as needed.

For a horse that knows how to neck rein, is soft in the face, knows how to bend laterally and has body control(head/neck, shoulders, ribcage, hip) a solid mouthpiece is the way to go. Broken mouthpiece are stepping stone to this desired result in a bridle horse.

edit: Just wanted to add the solid mouthpiece allows for one handed riding because when you do have to pick up and make contact it gives even pressure on both sides which should induce vertical flex at the poll(horse giving their face) and picking up of the shoulders as you drive from behind with the legs. Then the rein pressure guides the front end while legs and seat control the rib cage and hip. You get less bend and horse on the bridle and between the reins. Again the desired result in a bridle horse. In short you can control the front end with one hand easier in a solid a mouthpiece given the horse has been properly trained.

[WashingtonBay]

Thanks... My western experience is fairly shallow and long ago... and I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn last night. :)

[APPYT]

This bit (http://www.horseloverz.com/Kelly-Silver-Star-Billy-Allen-Reining-Bit-pr-296608.html)

http://images.auctionants.com/25540.jpg
may be a good option for you. The Billy Allen mouth is a mild 3 piece mouth. My Kimberwick is much like this and my horses like it fine. The shanks on this bit would help with cueing the neckreining. I have noticed my granddaughters horse neckreins much better in a shanked bit(I use a ported bit w/loose shanks) than even in the Kimberwick.

[3equines]

That is a very nice bit. Will fit the Western disciplines, too, if showing is in the future. I prefer the broken mouthpiece for a horse that does well in a snaffle bit, but I understand the concept behind true neck reining and true curb bit use and where a broken bit isn't a "true" curb bit, but I'm from the school of practical horsemanship in which you take what a horse allready knows and works well in, and change it a little bit at a time. (no pun intended;))

[Gliderider]

Thanks all for your help :)

Reinmaker This horse is soft in the face and body. He will give me his face at the trot even. I think I need the snaffle for practice more then he does. LOL !! Being for the last several years I have been riding gaited horse that direct rein. I am doing Clinton Anderson exercises with him. I am now working on moving his hips next his shoulders then I will ask for the side pass. He is doing great and knows it all its me that needs to practice. That is why I went to the snaffle for now. But need to find the curb bit to move to after I have this all down. I know he has been rode in a curb before. He is hard to find bits for he needs a 6 inch mouth being his mouth measures 5.5 wide. I know I read I could go with a 5.5 but I would prefer a 6 inch to give 1.4 inch on each side for comfort. Sorry this is so long. I have attached a link to a bit I found on ebay. What do you think of it ? I know its not a name bit but remember a 6 inch is hard to find. Thanks :) http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330348952630&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching

[Gliderider]

This is what Rainmaker had to say about above post in a PM and asked me to post it here. That it might be helpful to others. :)

Good idea stepping back to the snaffle as you get your cues down. Just don't be afraid to step up to the curb as your comfort level increases. It is not harsh and can actually really help you and the horse understand. It will help keep him between the reins and allow you to use less pressure to hold him in frame as you ask for the manuevers. If he understands lateral movement, direct rein, and neck reining already it may be time to go ahead and make the jump and see how he does.

When you first go up just don't ask a ton of him that day or for a couple days and see how he responds to it. That doesn't mean just let it dangle in his mouth. It means don't ask for quite as much lateral bend, and maybe don't try to side pass the first day. Just ride him and keep him collected. Check his face with it and test his response and suppleness to the bit. It isn't uncommon for them to overreact a little to the curb when first starting out or if he hasn't been in one in a while. Meaning you pick up and he overflexes some.

As far as that bit I think that would be a decent transition. Looks to have a smooth edge where the port begins from the bar. It doesn't have much of a port and won't offer much tongue relief, but will not use any palate pressure. This bit will work off bar and lateral tongue pressure. It also has swivel shanks which I like in a transition bit, and will allow for some two handed riding and getting a little more lateral movement should you need it. You may have to try a couple different bits out. Different horses just respond differently to different stimuli. I see no reason why you couldn't start here and see how he does with it.