Mud Management improvements, 2008.

[WashingtonBay]

I date this because we've tried other things in the past, I think we get better at managing our problem area every year. Last year, we graveled this traffic path from the barn to the paddock, and the gravel disappeared in a matter of a couple weeks and it turned to mud again. This year, we're covering it with mats.

Thumbnails below....

1. Before... mud. One mat in place...

2. After... All mats in place, draining down into my drainage ditch you can see. This property has a nice hardpan layer that is down about 6 inches. If I can keep that ditch clear, and I do, it will pull water away and drains really well. I'll be continuing to widen it over the next few weeks, as I do every year, over summer it tends to get filled in and silted up.

3. Cyn, hubby's horse, does not wait to check it out.

4. Bay wants to go around. Hubby blocks him.

5. Bay needing to be led up to it as he does not think it looks safe. :rolleyes:

[Cat]

Neat idea - looks like it would work.

[WashingtonBay]

Continued below... further encouragement to get Bay on board with the new plan...

I think this will work nicely! That patch gets a lot of water off the roof and traffic, and has always been a mess. Not this year, we hope. :D

We really look forward to our own place where we can do things our way... we'll be taking with us a lot of trial and error experience!

[Arrow]

Nice work! Gotta love that Bay, he reminds me of Arrow in some ways! I hope Arrow ages as well and as gracefully!

[WashingtonBay]

I think it'll work too. Needs some fine tuning I think, as it settles with traffic we can perfect the way it drains. When they mud it up... I can hose it off into the drainage. :D

[WashingtonBay]

Nice work! Gotta love that Bay, he reminds me of Arrow in some ways! I hope Arrow ages as well and as gracefully!

"This is nothing that should frighten an old A-Rab horse.... This is nothing that should frighten an old A-Rab horse.... This is nothing that should frighten an old A-Rab horse...."

[Arrow]

:funnypost:

[zoel_222]

Hmmm. Won't the mats get slippery if they get mud on them?

[WashingtonBay]

We got the textured ones for that reason... They have little bumpies on them.

And I'll routinely clean them off, I'm sure, when I'm out there cleaning stalls.

My bigger concern is that they'll move around and not stay where I want 'em.

[zoel_222]

You think of everything :) I might try that. How much were the mats if you don't mind me asking? My plan this year was to do hog fuel at $400 a load which would have to be redone every year. I wonder if mats would be a better investment.

[WashingtonBay]

The mats were $35 each. I wouldn't want to do a whole paddock in them:doh:, but one little walkway was affordable.

The smooth ones can be slick, the whole inside of the barn is matts on concrete, and the smooth ones can be slippery if wet... But I keep the bumpy ones in the doorways, and that has been a lot better for footing if they are departing the barn in a hurry.

[zoel_222]

I think that might work for me, then. I have a small space in front of my barn that gets up to their knees in mud. That took me by suprise when I moved in. I had no idea how much MUD there is in Oregon! It's not that big of a space but there is no avoiding it when they need to get to shelter.

[WashingtonBay]

We do know how to make mud in these parts, don't we!

And the first couple of years I made the big mistake of putting spent shavings down where it was muddy, which in time only makes it thicker and deeper and it never dries. It's taken a lot of muscle since then to scrape all that back out of there and get rid of it.

[zoel_222]

Yeah, I'm still skeptical of hog fuel. All that organic-ness seems like it would make things worse. My cousin's husband works for the Forest Service and swears by it. I put woodchips down last year (we had a big pile in our pasture when we moved in) and within two weeks it made the mud about 6" deeper. Bleh :doh:

[WashingtonBay]

They SAY hog fuel floats and stays on top of the mud. But I'm with you, over time, it would break down under horse feet and become part of the mud.

Gravel worked for a short time, but they tracked it all away. Perhaps bigger rock they wouldn't.

The other key is to get rid of the water coming off the barn. That's a source of most of it. Our lean-to has a gutter now, and a downspout that we piped away from the barn. The more water you can take away before it even gets there the better. Our challenge is keeping the drainages and gutters clear of needles and clogs, every week we have to clear them, as you can see we're under a lot of trees.

[Gypsy Rose]

"This is nothing that should frighten an old A-Rab horse.... This is nothing that should frighten an old A-Rab horse.... This is nothing that should frighten an old A-Rab horse...."

:hysterical: Gypsy woould have probably done the same thing, lol!:crazy:

[vicklynn]

I hear ya on pasture management.
I spent $450 on a drainage area this past yr. Sure worked wonders. If you continue to have an issue with that area. Dig deep, add 2 inch rock, then fill with gravel, you will see a difference.
I sure hope your matts do the trick:)

[zoel_222]

Drainage is definitely a problem. When it rains that area tends to stay puddley for a while. The roof is slanted so at least the runoff water goes elsewhere. Ideally I'd like to put in a concrete floor inside and outside the barn but I'm not going to be able to afford something like that for a while.

Check out how bad it got last year. Tee hee just kidding that was from the flood :D

[WashingtonBay]

Heh... yeah - you're going to need more than a few mats to solve that problem. :eek:

[WashingtonBay]

I think though, that you might be able to put some rock down to raise it up, and then mat at least the area in front of the barn and up to that gate, if that's what you're thinking.

[zoel_222]

That might work. I highlighted the bad areas that I need to fix. It might be too big of a job for the mats, I don't know.

[vicklynn]

Wow, that looks like a chore. I thought we had it bad last yr. WOW

[Sparrk]

My bigger concern is that they'll move around and not stay where I want 'em.

What about the spikes you can buy that hold down tents? Couldn't you hammer a few of those in to hold the mats in place?

[zoel_222]

There's a river just behind those trees. Usually it's down a 40 foot ravine but last winter it decided to overflow into our pasture.

[WashingtonBay]

There's another product besides mats... That Sedona just put down in her paddocks that is intended for larger areas. It's like a plastic grid that lets water through it... http://www.hoofgrid.com/

She filled it with gravel.

Maybe it runs less per square foot... haven't priced it.

http://www.hoofgrid.com/2c83cd80.png

[WashingtonBay]

What about the spikes you can buy that hold down tents? Couldn't you hammer a few of those in to hold the mats in place?

Could be, if they don't trip on the stakes. :D

The lower two will probably stay put. They're kindof wedged in there by the fence and that big tree.

It's the one up by the doorway to the barn that may migrate around. I'll keep an eye on it and see if it needs anything.

[rocknK]

Isn't there a brewery near you that brags about their water?? Maybe they'd like some of yours! We've had good luck out here with old asphalt scraping. Put down enough of it & no more mud.

[spotsmom]

Hey Bay, could you stake the corners? I have a friend that uses mats for her washrack. She stakes all four corners of each mat and that has definately helped with shifting. She found some tent stakes at a sporting goods store that look like an upside down "L". Just a thought...

[spotsmom]

whoops, would've helped if I had read the 3rd page...sorry!

[Peggy Sue]

If that doesn't work go ot Menards and tell them you want this stuff!!! http://www.usfabricsinc.com/products/drivewayfabric.shtml it works wonders you put it down then put your rock or whatever on TOP of it !!

[Toodlestoo]

We put mats down in the entrance way to our old barn because it was muddy all the time. It seemed to do the trick. We just covered it with pellets and it's been fine ever since.

[WashingtonBay]

Isn't there a brewery near you that brags about their water?? Maybe they'd like some of yours!

I don't think horse paddock runoff is what they had in mind when they said "It's the Water" :)

[rocknK]

Well, thats kinda what that beer tastes like...........:p

[WashingtonBay]

And that was before I gave them my runoff! It's closed down now... the Olympia brewery. Was sad because it was a major local business and landmark for decades. Now it's just the biggest old abandoned building in town.

[rocknK]

In my younger, dumber years I did my best to keep them in business. Do you think it was your runoff or my lack of patronage that put them under??

[WashingtonBay]

Well, neither one helped. :p

They were purchased a couple of times, the last time by Miller.

The direct cause of that venture not working was the city, if you ask me. They were trying to extort the brewery, the deepest pocket, into paying for a whole new waste treatment plant I think, with their exorbitant fees.

Part of the plant is still in operation making.... bottled water (the water IS good!) but that operation employs about 40 people, not the 400 the brewery used to employ. The city remains firmly in the way of another brewer buying it. I think the city would like the land to expand the park. They're just waiting for the building to fall apart and become worthless so they don't have to pay fair value for it.

[IrisGreen]

I don't have a mud problem...Ok, well I do kind of. My driveway is all gravel so I don't have a problem there but Muffins pen is dirt/clay.

It's dry and we haven't had a rain in a while but I am having a problem with his permanent pee spots. The back area just never drys out and he keeps peeing on top of it. Now winter is coming and I know it's going to get soggy out there and that area is just nasty.

I had a bull dozer come and take the top layer off that back area of his pen and uncover the major areas of pee. They are uncovered now and I thought they would dry out but there not and Muffin is insisting on going pee in the same area no mater how wet it already is.

I purchased 3 bags of Stall Dry (not Dry Stall but there about the same thing). It reminds me of kitty litter but fine almost like sand just more abrasive. It's non-toxic and absorbs pee and smell but doesn't clump together like kitty liter ;). You can use it in paddocks, and stalls along with on dirt. So, I am going to go out and dig up some of those pee spots today and try to get the main wet areas out and fill them up with this Stall Dry.

Anyone ever used this stuff before? My dirt is high in clay so once it gets wet the first inch or two is like snot but under it's dry as a bone. It almost absorbs water but once saturated it doesn't let it dry out easily or drain away and the deeper the snot gets. I figure this Stall Dry will help brake it up and make it drain better on his pee spots?

I woudnt have such a problem if it was a regular type of mud but this stuff is a fine powder and when wet a slipery snot ontop of hard dry ground so you don't sink in you slid on top of it. Except those pee spots because they are already deeply saturated.

I hate the dirt I have...Muffin goes ice skating every winter and he walks so slow not to slip.

[WashingtonBay]

I have used Stall Dry in stalls. It will absorb a lot of moisture. Then you have to remove it, because like your clay, it will just hold it.

[IrisGreen]

I have used Stall Dry in stalls. It will absorb a lot of moisture. Then you have to remove it, because like your clay, it will just hold it.

hmmm, well that's not good.... I guess I will just have to shovel the wet spots out and fill them in with dry dirt and hope it drys out faster then Muffin can soak it. lol

I like your mats. I want to get a few for under Muffins shelter. I will have to make sure I get the bumpy ones or with holes in them not the flat ones. I could totaly see me sliping underneath him come winter time with mud on my boots. Not a good idea.

I hope your mats work out. Is there a way you could build up the path so it's higher then the souronding ground? I know that would be a lot of work but it would allow the water to run off the path to the sides. I guess you would have to do that in the sumer when it's all dry though. Then again the horses would trash it and make it flat again in no time...So, I guess that wouldnt help much in the long run.

[WashingtonBay]

Flow wise on ours, it actually works best for it to just funnel the water down to the drainage. The problem I see this morning is they've already developed a valley between the two roots you can see under the lowest mat.

It really should have been graveled first, but that would mean digging out the soft stuff first, and we tried to get by on the cheap.... and lazy. We'll fill that today so it's flat.


As for your pee problem, if you really want to solve it I'd hire a backhoe to come in and dig as deep a hole as he can dig in the pee spot and fill it with rock. Big inch or more in diameter round rock that will drain. You can cover the top with a thinner layer of something else, but hopefully something that will also drain.

Or, you could put down something that WONT absorb at all, like mats, there, and shavings on top for him to pee on, that you then remove.

I'm amazed, really, that your summer sun wouldn't dry it out. But I guess in a small space, even hot southern California sun can't compete with the bladder on a draft horse. ;)

[IrisGreen]

Ohh, I just thought it might work with the mats on top to keep the path nice and compact so it stays built up?

They also have paver bricks. Like the big round and octagon shaped stepping stone ones but they are made out of recycled rubber and are pebbly on top. But, you would have to lay down a thick layer of sand or something to build up the path then put the paver's down and hope the water didn't wash the sand away too badly.. I guess that's not the best idea ether..

[IrisGreen]

Just saw your last message #40.

Yeah, that's a good idea. Muffins pen is pretty big compared to most stalled horses. His is 40x60 feet or larger but he only goes in the back corner section and in the same area all the time. The sun does dry out the top layer but if you make the mistake of stepping in it not knowing it's there you will fall on your butt!! lol I don't want to do anything drastic because I plan on taking out his pen and building a mare motel with 4 pens out back. so I don't want to spend the money when everything is going to be moved around and that wont be his pee area anymore once the new stalls are built.

I think he likes going back there because it's already wet so it doesn't splash on him as much when it hits the ground like it does on hard dry ground. If I put mats out there I know he would play with them and drag them around but it might get him peeing in different spots if he figures out peeing on the mat is worse then peeing on the dirt. Maybe one of those utility mats with the holes in it. So at least it could get air to help dry it out and also keep him from sinking in to the pee spots with his hooves...hmm that might work!