Proper saddle fitting

[minskeep]

I fear my barrel saddle may be a little too wide for my coming 3yr old. In the summer she does get girth sores too even though I make sure she doesnt have any wrinkles under there before I get on. I was told to try a different type of girth. Right now I am using neopreme one. So I am hoping I can solve the sores with a different type of girth but I also think that my saddle is too wide for her. I havnt measured it yet but it does sit kind of low on her withers. I have an extra thick pad so it doesnt actually rest on her withers but is that enough? Should I invest in a nicer pad? I would buy a new saddle but I cant afford it right now. Other than the girth sores, the saddle doesnt seem to make her back sore but since shes still growing theres no telling what she will be like this summer. Any suggestions?

[shewasmyshadow]

I don't think we can offer advice unless we can see pictures.

[AppyLover]

A hospital felt or 100% wool felt lined cinch http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail.html?pgguid=2e87bf91-7b6a-11d5-a192-00b0d0204ae5 or a mohair rope cinch should help with the girth soars.

As far as the pad goes you can add a wool felt liner or get a felt wither pad to help buffer the withers against the saddle and once she starts filling out remove the bulk as it is not needed.

[WashingtonBay]

Pictures would be good, to better evaluate how it fits with the pad setup you're using...


As for girth soring... I have a horse who is real sensitive to girth galling... he wasn't always this way, in his case I think his skin is getting thinner and more sensitive as he ages. Some horses are born more sensitive than others, though.

But my tips for preventing soring would be to first, make sure both he and the cinch are perfectly clean, every time. For my Bay, it means I hose him down before every ride, and hose down the girth after every ride so it's clean for next time. If dirt and dust get in there during a ride and you can wipe it away so it doesn't rub, do that.

Clip winter hair so it doesn't grab.

Spray a bit of show sheen right in the armpit area to make the skin slide easier under the girth.

Cinch up as far back as you can so there is the least amount of movement.

Pull the legs forward after cinching to eliminate wrinkles...

And in my case, I don't over tighten the cinch, I leave it fairly loose. I recommend you do what you need to to be safe but consider leaving it looser rather than tighter.

If I do all of those things, I don't get cinch sores on Bay. If I skip any one of them, we do.


Neoprene can be very hot. Switch to a different type.

[minskeep]

A hospital felt or 100% wool felt lined cinch http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail.html?pgguid=2e87bf91-7b6a-11d5-a192-00b0d0204ae5 or a mohair rope cinch should help with the girth soars.

As far as the pad goes you can add a wool felt liner or get a felt wither pad to help buffer the withers against the saddle and once she starts filling out remove the bulk as it is not needed.


I was told mohair would be a good replacement. So I may have to get one. I will also try to find some pictures that may help.

[minskeep]

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/Believe%20in%20Dreams%20Ranch/STAR/0506091413.jpg

Shes a little more filled out now then in this picture but this is what im working with.

[WashingtonBay]

The angles of that saddle actually follow quite nicely. I'm not seeing it as too wide.

If the pad material compresses when you're on it, reducing the wither clearance, you can get a different, more substantial pad.

With that pad, be sure to pull the pad up prior to cinching, as the pad pulled tight across the wither can provide just as much pressure as if the saddle were riding there. I actually prefer a contoured or cutback pad in many cases, just to eliminate the pad bulk and pressure on the wither where there should be no real contact at all.

[3equines]

I agree ,the saddle doesn't look too wide. When you put your hand under the horn from the front of the saddle, can you feel where the bars are making contact with the back of the horse? If there is a 'hollow' area behind the shoulder, then that may be part of the girthing problem.

A good pad can help with the girth problem, too. I recommend two styles of pads: one, if there is a hollow behind the wither, try a SMX Charmayne James Ortho Sport pad. Two, if the saddle fits well behind the wither, look at one of the newer pad styles in which there is a built-up area under the saddle bars. There are inexpensive :
http://www.horse.com/item/performers-1st-choice-felt-pimple-grip-pad/SLT901134/

moderate: http://www.horse.com/item/Ride-N-Lite-Orthopedic-Saddle-Pad/WIR29/

and premium versions: http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail.html?pgguid=dc907097-df85-42bf-92c2-47b0a222eabd

I also really like this felt Smart CInch for horses that are sensitive in the girth area
http://www.bonanzle.com/booths/almostaranch1/items/Smart_Cinch_Weaver_Leather_Western_Girth_Felt_Tack _36_ or Amazon.com: SMART CINCH WEAVER WESTERN GIRTH ROPER FELT TACK BROWN 36 INCH: Sports & Outdoors
be sure to get the kind that is wider in the middle (roper style), it is harder to find.

it distributes pressure over a wider area, reduces pinching where you tighten ,and the felt prevents rubbing and chafing.

[minskeep]

Thanks for the info! :cowboy:

[g8tedsaddles]

Galling is sometimes (not always) caused by conformation. Look at your horse or post a photo of it from head to tail and head straight. Now look at the wither and the sweet spot and line it up with the back edge of the horses scapula (the area where the wither joins the spine and ribcage) Is that area forward of the elbow? If it is, then you need to centerfire rig your saddle so that you can suspend the girth (full rigging needed, inskirt rear rigging will not work with centerfire) back away from that elbow.

[minskeep]

heres the only picture i have of her saddle sweat marks. not exactly the perfect angle but its the best I can do until she sheds. http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/Believe%20in%20Dreams%20Ranch/STAR/DSC_0189.jpg

heres her profile shot http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/Believe%20in%20Dreams%20Ranch/STAR/DSC_0018.jpg

[minskeep]

I think I can probably get away with not having the saddle pulled forward so much with her since she is kind of long bodied. I dont know how much it would help though.

[3equines]

Your horse has a beautiful topline, one that looks like it is made for a saddle - no deep hollow spots behind the wither, a nice even depth over the ribs from wither to loin. The trouble with trying to move a saddle 'back' is that it is going to slide back into the place it wants to sit - right behind the shoulder - once you start riding in it. For now, you can probably make things more comfy with a good pad and a felt cinch.

Center-fire rigging would help, but you don't really have that option with your saddle. Even a saddle with good 7/8 rigging option in the front would help, yours looks like it is full front rigging, or at least it rides on your horse that way. So, just keep a mental note when you do buy a saddle in the future - the flank rigging needs to be a metal D or ring that is rigged into the tree. That's pretty much a minimum requirement for all my saddles, now, because I like the added stability and options.

What kind of riding do you do? If you are not competing, you can make a center-fire rigging option for your saddle by using a wide leather latigo strap that runs over the top of the saddle behind the cantle. The advantage of center-fire is that it will move the girth back, and it will also balance out the saddle better so that all of the wieght is not riding over the girt area on the front.

Here's a basic how-to. Remember that if you do use center-fire rigging, BOTH SIDES of the saddle have to be rigged this way, not just the left side.
YouTube- Julie Goodnight teaches how to use Saddle Rigging

[shewasmyshadow]

I think you've already gotten some great advice, but just had to add... Your horse is GORGEOUS! :D

[minskeep]

Thanks :)

[minskeep]

I thought I would add a photo of the horse that I used the same saddle on but never had saddle fitting issues with her. On the left is Moe, I used the saddle on her for 2 yrs and never had any problems. On the right is Star, I almost always get galls when I use the saddle on her. Normally just when she gets sweaty from a long ride.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/moestar.jpg

[3equines]

Star is what they call 'slab sided'. Moe has a beefy shoulder and a wide barrel, Star has a nice, long muscular shoulder but her barrel is sort of built on the same plane as her shoulder. This might be where the cinch galling comes into play; the contour between the shoulder and the barrel on Moe keeps the saddle sitting pretty solid on him, with the weight balancing over his back, but with Star the saddle will tend to 'pull' into the forehand because there is not a big shoulder there to keep it locked down into that dip between the shoulder and the barrel that Moe has.

Star is also narrower in the loin than Moe. There is a possibility that Moe's saddle isn't being supported well over Star's back under the cantle of the saddle, so this would put even more weight on the forehand. If you put your hand under the skirt near the back of the saddle, feel for where the bars are touching her sides. Usually you can't get much more than a fingertip under there if it fits well, but if the saddle is too wide then the edge of it will be 'hanging out' a bit before it starts to make contact with the horse.

I might be having a lapse of memory, but did you mention that Star is still quite young? She may put on more shoulder as she grows and is conditioned, but I think she is kind of just built long and lean, too, like a Thoroughbred.

[mandisue]

My mare was VERY cinchy, never got sores though, I had to buy a bigger saddle but your's looks like it fits fine. Also just to edit, I had to get a different cinch as well, I bought the new charmayne james waffle weave barrel cinch, it's supposed to flex with the horse so it doesn't overtighten.

[minskeep]

Here are some more pictures i took today. I think Moe broke the saddle in well and she was much wider than Star. So the back of the saddle does look like it was meant for another horse but I think the wither area is almost the same. I was doing some researching and i may push the saddle back an inch or 2 from now on when saddling. I fear I may be pulling it too far forward and thus not giving her shoulder enough room to move freely. I also took some photos of another saddle I might start using more if it can be center rigged. It measures about the same as the barrel saddle though.

Oh and I know she looks kinda ribby in her picture but she is fed grain and beet pulp every day and out on hay. Also been wormed. Shes just hard to put a lot of weight on. Shes like 3equines said, built more like a Thoroughbred. :)

(Star today)
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7091.jpg

(Withers and shoulder)
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7095.jpg

(Withers)
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7097.jpg

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7098.jpg

(Cinch)
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7100.jpg

(Star with saddle)

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7107.jpg

(Back of saddle)

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7130.jpg


(Other saddle pictures)

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7086.jpg

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/minskeep/100_7088.jpg

[minskeep]

Star is what they call 'slab sided'. Moe has a beefy shoulder and a wide barrel, Star has a nice, long muscular shoulder but her barrel is sort of built on the same plane as her shoulder. This might be where the cinch galling comes into play; the contour between the shoulder and the barrel on Moe keeps the saddle sitting pretty solid on him, with the weight balancing over his back, but with Star the saddle will tend to 'pull' into the forehand because there is not a big shoulder there to keep it locked down into that dip between the shoulder and the barrel that Moe has.

Star is also narrower in the loin than Moe. There is a possibility that Moe's saddle isn't being supported well over Star's back under the cantle of the saddle, so this would put even more weight on the forehand. If you put your hand under the skirt near the back of the saddle, feel for where the bars are touching her sides. Usually you can't get much more than a fingertip under there if it fits well, but if the saddle is too wide then the edge of it will be 'hanging out' a bit before it starts to make contact with the horse.

I might be having a lapse of memory, but did you mention that Star is still quite young? She may put on more shoulder as she grows and is conditioned, but I think she is kind of just built long and lean, too, like a Thoroughbred.


Thanks, you make a lot of sense! I need to go to a saddle fitting clinic and re-learn a lot of this stuff.

[3equines]

Thanks, you make a lot of sense! I need to go to a saddle fitting clinic and re-learn a lot of this stuff.


I've learned it all the HARD WAY!!!! Between a Polish Arabian with high withers and a short back, and 2 Haflingers that have different shapes to their backs.... it has been a trip.

The second saddle can easily be center-fire rigged. You do have a NICE CINCH;) but I can see where it all gets sucked into Star's elbow, even felt padding won't help this a lot.

When I center-fire my cinches, I do it a little different from the video. I START the latigo leather on the flank cinch (tie it to the saddle here), go through the ring of the cinch, then go to the front rigging of the saddle, then back through the cinch and tie off the latigo on the flank cinch ring of the saddle. This version holds the saddle back away from the shoulders better than if you start the latigo on the front sinch rigging.

Basically, you are making a big "V", twice. You have a lot of control over how far back you get the actual cinch. However, both methods have one similar pricniple: you buckle or tie off your cinch after it has gone through the flank rigging. If your latigo stap is too short to make 2 'V''s then you can do it the way the video shows, start in the front but be sure to end in the back rigging.

Your girth does not need to be in the middle of the horse's barrel to work center-fire. In your case, getting it to lie a hand's width from the 'elbow' would be great.

[Equine_Woman]

3equines, do you have a photo of your rigging when it's done? :) Pretty please! :)

[3equines]

Will get photos up this weekend if not sooner. Too busy with homework right now (Though you can't tell because I am goofing around on the Forum;)) I thought I had some but can't find 'em.