Impulse goats! - Vet visits and other cruelties of life :~\ page 12

[WashingtonBay]

Hubby and I went out garage sale-ing this morning looking for furniture for the guest apartment. We did, by the way, find a terrific futon for up there.

But we also stopped by the farmer's exchange and saw the cutest little goat that hubby didn't even know he wanted for $30. :D

There was one baby goat there and he looked so pitiful, just weaned this morning and all alone, shivering... I mean really, what choice did I have? ;)

We bought that one, and his brother who was delivered about an hour later. :)

Aren't they cute???

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[zoel_222]

Aww they're so adorable!!

[Dakota Sunrise]

Definately didn't have a choice, you had to take them!:p ;) :D

They are sooooo cute. What are you going to name them?:)

I saw your new avatar before I read this thread. I was like, "I didn't know the WB's had goats!?!?!) :p

Are they disbudded or have their horns just not grown much yet? Any idea what breed they are? I was going to guess Pygmy but I'm not sure, kind of hard to tell. I love their markings whatever they are!:p

[WashingtonBay]

I'm so glad we had the brother coming, because if I'd have bought just the one, and heard it crying and flailing itself against the barn walls unhappy, I'd have been in a panic. But he did settle down, and was downright happy once brother arrived.

So.... Dakota... everyone.... tell me what I need to know about goats!


We're going to build a small goat pen off that stall for them for now, we'll keep them in the stall at night, but it's my hope that they can be in the yard grazing most of the days. Can't right now yet, the dogs are just a little over-excited about them and have to be calmed down. I'm sure they will be fine shortly, they've just never seen a goat before, and are VERY curious. And these guys are NOT very big.

[Dakota Sunrise]

So.... Dakota... everyone.... tell me what I need to know about goats!





Lol, you got it!:p But later, I have go walk my doggie and take the horses to play pasture.
Have you read the thread "Goats!" yet? There's some good info in there.:)

[WashingtonBoy]

We have named them Fíli and Kíli. :)

They are Nigerian Dwarf and have been disbudded. Do they grow back or is that permanent?

[Dakota Sunrise]

We have named them Fíli and Kíli. :)

They are Nigerian Dwarf and have been disbudded. Do they grow back or is that permanent?

Awe, cute names.:)

No, the horns won't--or shouldn't--grow back. If they start to you can take them back to the vet and have them disbudded again. You shouldn't have to, but occasionally they will grow back if they weren't taken off well enough. Our vet only charges $15 per kid the first time, and it's free if we have to take them back a second time. You want them disbudded, it's safer for all involved parties.

I figured they were Pygmies or Dwarfs- very cute!:)

[Petra]

Very cute! I love their names too.
Glad they are disbudded. Ours weren't and not even electric fence kept them contained. They were quite troublemakers.
When we had goats they grazed all the time, went to sleep in their "house" at night.
Than they figured out that they liked the dog house better than their own and used to kick our dogs out in a middle of the night. It was unpleasant to chase goats at 2am. Especially in the winter. My poor dogs were cold and barking like crazy.

[vicklynn]

Aww how cute!

Love their color!

[BlaiseGlaze]

love em love em love em!

[Tiz]

"...but it's my hope that they can be in the yard grazing most of the days."

You two city slickers or somethin'? You mean up on the porch, or standing on the car, or exploring down the driveway, don't you?:)

Cute little creatures.

[natisha]

Those have got to be the cutest things ever. You could put dog collars on them & teach them to walk on a leash, it's fun, plus it will come in handy.
Soon would be a good time to teach them to pick up their feet too.
Boys, girls?
You are so lucky.:)

[Gliderider]

Congrats on the new kids. They are both soo Cute. I love goats they are such sweet pets.

[WashingtonBay]

They are cute as the dickens... Been out playin' with 'em. :) Not overly handled like the ones at the petting zoo, but once you catch'em, we can hold em OK. They like to be back-scratched... I'll try to see if there's a treat they particularly like that I can find and work with 'em a little more. :)

We made them a temporary 12x24ish pen off their stall so they can get outside a little, but I'm not leaving them out there unattended yet. They are little escape monsters, I can tell, walking around pushing on the fence everywhere! We've got hot wire on the top of it....

And Barkley the beagle is still a little too interested in them, so we'll leave them secured in their stall when unattended for now. He'll get better. And they'll get better. They've got straw and hay and a dog house in there they can climb in and on, they've had a hard day, probably getting goat-tired. :)

[shewasmyshadow]

They are cute as the dickens... Been out playin' with 'em. :) Not overly handled like the ones at the petting zoo, but once you catch'em, we can hold em OK. They like to be back-scratched... I'll try to see if there's a treat they particularly like that I can find and work with 'em a little more. :)

We made them a temporary 12x24ish pen off their stall so they can get outside a little, but I'm not leaving them out there unattended yet. They are little escape monsters, I can tell, walking around pushing on the fence everywhere! We've got hot wire on the top of it....

And Barkley the beagle is still a little too interested in them, so we'll leave them secured in their stall when unattended for now. He'll get better. And they'll get better. They've got straw and hay and a dog house in there they can climb in and on, they've had a hard day, probably getting goat-tired. :)

That statement sums them up. Once they get out, and they will, they will try to destroy everything of value that is left out. I don't know how many of my things my mom's goats detroyed. :(

Anywho... Get them lots of toys. They love big tractor tires, homemade bridges, old electrical contruction spools, pallets, etc. Sprinkle feed or treats around on their play structures to encourage climbing and investigating. They love those little pellet horse treats. We call them "carrot crunchers", but I'm not sure if that's their actual name.

Might want to look into a single goat stanchon. They are invaluable for trimming hooves on the adult goats.

You may want to consider hand feeding their meals for a few days. That will friendly them up really quick. Getting them bonded to you will be really invaluable when their older. Once their adults they don't bond as quick or as readily.

Also, don't feed too much hay. Force them to graze. If they come to expect hay (alfalfa) they will start refusing grass. We found that out with our goats. Once their spoiled they don't like to go off and do their own thing (grazing).

My parents use a specific goat pellet and keep the diets very low calorie. Once those pgymies get the basketball tummy it is almost impossible to get rid of.

[natisha]

Treats: potato & nacho chips.
They'll need a white salt block too.
Opps, looked again, 2 boys

[oursarge]

So Precious!!!! I love goats, I really want some, wish we didn't have the bobcats and coyotes, we could keep them in a dog run but that seems too small for them. I'm so happy you got them, congratulations on the new family members.

[rocknK]

Congrats on the new kids. They are both soo Cute. I love goats they are such sweet pets.
And quite tasty too!! Did I ever tell you folks about the time down in Old Mexico?? All I can say that goat slow-turned over coals is yummy!! My mouth waters every time I see one of the little buggers!:p

[Dakota Sunrise]

Ok, here's a little random goatie info you may wish to know.:) You might already know some or even all of it- if you do just ignore me.:p

Trimming hooves: If they're just weaned and still little you shouldn't have to worry about this yet, their hooves don't grow that fast when they're babies. But when they get bigger you'll need to trim their hooves. If your goat is well behaved (stands still, doesn't kick, etc) it's really easy. If your goat isn't well behaved, it's still not hard. It just takes a second person to help hold. My mom and I do all of ours with little to no issues.
Although I'm sure you can buy actual real goat hoof trimmers, we use the little pruner/nipper things you can buy at Big Lots. Like these kinda (on the right): http://www.biglots.com/Outdoorlife/fullview.aspx?cid=61&sid=219&iid=7596

Feeding: Goats are easy to feed. Ours get hay (when there's not enough grass, jagger bushes, leaves, and weeds in the pasture to satisfy them) and a mixture of corn and oats. Which they don't really *need* but they enjoy it, and it's good for them to have the extra calories in the winter. They do make goat grain of course but ours do just fine on regular corn and oats and hay. They eat the same hay my horses do.
Since yours are babies you want to go easy on the grain, especially if they're not used to it. You don't want them to overeat. Not so much because they'll get fat (which they will if Nigerian Dwarfs are like Pygmies- I've never seen a thin Pygmy. Almost all of them get these plump, I-swallowed-a-beach-ball looking bellies), but because you don't want them to bloat. Which is this: http://kinne.net/bloat.htm

Deworming: For deworming we like Safe Guard paste or pellets and a liquid Ivermectrin (the kind we use also kills lice which is good. It's a pour-on that goes on their backs). There are specific dewormers for goats but they can be hard to find. A lot of cow, horse, and sheep dewormers can be used for goats as long as you're very careful to give a small dose. You could ask your vet what dewormers would be safe for goats, he should know.:)


Are you going to keep them as bucks or are you going to whether (= geld) them? Since you don't have does it may not be a big deal to leave them, er.. intact. Whethering can make them a little more mellow and keeps them from getting stinky and doing foul male things at breeding season (like peeing on themselves and everything else, etc). But if you don't have does they may not even get stinky. And of course if you have any plans to breed you won't want to whether them. I have one whether and he doesn't act "bucky" like our breeding buck does. Sammy (the guy who fathered all our kids) is a big baby and very friendly, but you don't want to pet him when it's breeding season.:innocent: Kid (my whethered buck) is safe to pet year-round.:D

I can't really think of anything else right now. If you have any questions feel free to ask if you want to!:D

[dustys_girlly]

So Precious!!!! I love goats, I really want some, wish we didn't have the bobcats and coyotes, we could keep them in a dog run but that seems too small for them. I'm so happy you got them, congratulations on the new family members.

we have bobcats and coyotes here as well as bears and mountain lions and have never had a problem with the goats. we have lost any kind of bird you can have to them but our goats have been free range for a year(wow i cant believe we have had them a year!) and have yet to have a problem with them. but ours still have their horns for that reason.

WBay they are sooo cute!! makes me want to get more. we had ours in a pen at night and on a lead in the day for the first month then after that is was pen at night and loose during the day for a month and now they are always loose. we dont feed them anything special. they eat hay with the horses and our land lord gives them their green scraps. as well as they eat anything, ANYTHING, that they can get into their mouth. dont let anything you value get within their range and remember they have great balance on their back legs.

[jeezitsjacki]

aww cute. I know nothing about goats, but I may have to come play with them!

[WashingtonBay]

Terrific information ladies! I appreciate it! Any guesses as to how old they are? I didn't ask the guy! He did say they're way past time to be weaned, and also said they might only grow a little bit more?

We went out and tried to handle them a bit more... they're still a little skittish but they'll come around I'm sure. Figured out that baby carrots aren't all that popular but fresh green grass and clover was. We picked a lot of green grass for them and they ate a bit from our hands, Fili is just a bit braver than Kili. :)

Not sure if my plan to let them free range in the yard will ever work or how I'll protect my flowers, but maybe they'll get to where they can be loose at least in short bursts to play. I think tomorrow we'll string a temporary larger area with field fence where there's more room and more grass, and they can also get to know the dogs more.

[CaddoCinnamon]

They are cute WB's.

[Tiz]

You ate goat, rnk? How many days did you go without food before the BBQ? How many shots of JD prior to sitting down to eat? I don't know, but I suspect there were extenuating circumstances leading to dinner that night that have muddled your memory. Good tip though. Mexicans love goat dinners, so they're really easy to sell, especially around Thanksgiving!:)

[natisha]

You ate goat, rnk? How many days did you go without food before the BBQ? How many shots of JD prior to sitting down to eat? I don't know, but I suspect there were extenuating circumstances leading to dinner that night that have muddled your memory. Good tip though. Mexicans love goat dinners, so they're really easy to sell, especially around Thanksgiving!:)There's times I feel like eating my goat, like this morning when she decided to butt me for no reason. I wouldn't really do it but don't tell her that.

[GrungeEquestrian]

Aw, they are adorable.

[shewasmyshadow]

Figured out that baby carrots aren't all that popular but fresh green grass and clover was. We picked a lot of green grass for them and they ate a bit from our hands, Fili is just a bit braver than Kili. :)

Yeah, goats can and will choke on stuff, so if you feed carrots or apple pieces cut them up kind of small. ;) Also, they love bread crusts.

[palomino]

OH EM GEE. They are so cute, congrats on the new family members- what does Bay think of them?

[WashingtonBay]

The horses stared at them a long time, goats stared at horses. Not sure what anyone thought! Just curious. :)

These guys are pretty scared still, and I think they want their mommy. But they're out in their little yard now nibbling and playing little goat games. I want to make them a little bit bigger area here after breakfast.

[vicklynn]

and playing little goat games.

So, how do the goat games go? Are there directions?
Do they play cards, or what?

LOL

I know, but it was funny,,,,goat games...heheheee

Hope to see pics of them in their new area soon!

[gabhainn]

Not sure if my plan to let them free range in the yard will ever work or how I'll protect my flowers, but maybe they'll get to where they can be loose at least in short bursts to play. I think tomorrow we'll string a temporary larger area with field fence where there's more room and more grass, no way you can protect your flowers with free range goats, my friend Tom has a large goat farm and the running joke (esp for boers) if you want a fence to hold a goat it needs to be waterproof

You ate goat, rnk? How many days did you go without food before the BBQ? How many shots of JD prior to sitting down to eat? I
there is very little better to eat than cabrito, .....Kevin

[Rabid_Raccoon]

Adorable! Do you plan to let them out with the horses at all? Sorry if it was mentioned, I didn't see anything. Congrats on the new family members :)

[WashingtonBay]

They're cute little monsters :)

We're getting a kick out of watching them. Bay is very maternal and protective of them. He was running Cyn off earlier while they were napping especially, standing watch over them.

We're getting the beagle sorted out... Had to discipline him a bit for lunging and bellerin' at them. By the end there, he was better. :)

[WashingtonBay]

Adorable! Do you plan to let them out with the horses at all? Sorry if it was mentioned, I didn't see anything. Congrats on the new family members :)

I don't think so... but we'll see. They're so small...

[CaddoCinnamon]

Cool isn't wonderful to watch how some horses are maternal like that. We had to separate Cinnamon from Dee when she had Cutter because Cinnamon would take her away from Dee. Cute goats. I can't wait to see what you all are going to do with their space.

[natisha]

Boy, they are little compared to the Beagle. They have those neck things too, I forgot what they are called, wattles? . Too cute.

[WashingtonBay]

Well he's a bigger than average beagle... but it's impolite to tell him that :D


We did put a dog house and a crate in their stall for them to jump up on, and that was a big hit... no pictures of that yet though... A few more pics... then we gotta get our momentum up for a ride or something this afternoon.

[Steelhorserider]

Very cute!

[Dakota Sunrise]

Terrific information ladies! I appreciate it! Any guesses as to how old they are? I didn't ask the guy! He did say they're way past time to be weaned, and also said they might only grow a little bit more?


It's hard to tell, but I'd guess they're quite a bit past 8 weeks (which is usual weaning age for goat kids). Maybe 3 or 4 months old or so?
Is the top of their heads still kind of black from where they burned off (disbudded) the horns? Or does it look all healed up? That's usually done pretty young before the horns grow much, so that might give you a little bit of an idea of how old they are.

We went out and tried to handle them a bit more... they're still a little skittish but they'll come around I'm sure. Figured out that baby carrots aren't all that popular but fresh green grass and clover was. We picked a lot of green grass for them and they ate a bit from our hands, Fili is just a bit braver than Kili. :)

They will calm down, just keep at it. My mom and I once rescued 12 (I think?) kids from a dairy farm. He was going to take them to auction. They were still just babies and needed milk so we had to get them on the bottle. They had never been handled before and had nursed for at least 3 weeks before we got them. It wasn't easy, but they all learned to love the bottle and us in just a few days. It can be done.:) Just go out and sit with them quietly and they'll get curious and start to approach you. Giving them treats will of course help too!:p

Most baby goats won't eat carrots or apples, etc. Try it again when they're older, I bet they'll like them then. My adult goats love baby carrots but the little ones don't seem to understand what they are.:p

[WashingtonBay]

Oh yes, they've made a lot of progress today. We've spent a lot of time with them. Didn't fence in more pen yet, we actually decided for getting them tame and handlable, the small space was actually better. They kinda have to deal with us! :)

We learned that fresh picked whole dandelions are about the best thing ever :)

And I got head-butted, and I took it as a good step for us. :) They're a LOT of fun. :)

[lovesfortune]

How cute are they!?!?!

[oursarge]

They are so precious.

[Dakota Sunrise]

Awe, great pics! They are so cute!:)

[WashingtonBay]

Monsters!

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(Only let them eat out of there a few seconds, long enough to take the picture...)




Foiled!

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[Tiz]

You are so lucky you had no goat whiz in the grain.

[Duchess47]

Goats don't graze unless there's nothing else they can reach - no trees, no flowers, no hay, no horse's tails. So now I know sho your little friend is. They are darling. If you are going to let them run loose, get them a llama for protection. :)

[OwnedByOurHorses]

They are just to cute. . I love to watch my two little one. We have mother and daughter and the daughter is a happy playful little brat. Ours are turned out with the horses. Just have to keep a eye on the horse's tails. They do love to nibble on those. We spray yuck on the tails and that last a good while. If we notice the girls paying to much attention to the horses we know it's time to spray the tails again.
We try not to feed ours any grain. If we do they will refused to graze and come begging at the back door for food. Ours have horns so electric fences don't keep them out. They will eat your garden if they can figure out a escape route. Ours love to rub thier horns up against fences where as they have learned they can stretch the fence then use thier horns to pick up the fence just enough to slide under.. Due to our aussie and heeler they know better than to try and get the main yard. Though they do love to bug the crap out of the dogs by charging the main fence getting the dogs all upset.

[oursarge]

The place we got Rompy had one goat that had the run of everything [The place is far off the road] it is so cute but will come up and ram you in the back of the legs so it has to be watched. It's a funny goat, goes in the stalls with the horse and there is a platform for people to sit and watch while people are riding in the arena and he sits up there watching too. I wanted to take him home along with Romp.!!!! The stable has an Angora Goat, she is beautiful and then they have the little pygmy goats. I love them too, I love them all and I want some but it wouldn't be fair to keep 2 goats in a dog run and anything we had would have to have a top on it so nothing could get to them. They coyotes, bob cats and even the bear are causing so much havick here with baby animals or small ones. It's so upsetting.

[WashingtonBay]

I think mine will be OK out and about during the day, but will probably always be locked in at night to make sure they're safe from coyotes.

[WashingtonBay]

Well, today I made a temporary bigger goat pen. This is in a place that's real hard to mow because there's exposed cedar roots everywhere, so it's a good spot for them to graze.

I just look at the size of these goats and the amount of forage there is just in this yard, and the amount of time they spend goofing off and sleeping, instead of eating, and I'm not sure they're going to have much effect, yet. I think I need about 20 of these little monsters. ;)

Our other animals still find them quite fascinating... I guess I do too :)

[Equine_Woman]

AWWWWWW!!!! What cuties!! I love my goats!! They are such characters!! You guys will really love having them around!! Mine LOVE french fries. They will meet you at the truck if you go through McDonalds. . .I always save them a few. . Our old goat (who has passed) would try to climb in the truck if you didn't have his french fries ready. . .)

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Awfully darn cute. :)

[Tiz]

Mr. Beagle Dog looks pretty intent, doesn't he? As if, Mr. B, chubby as you are, I don't think the fence is what keeps them safe from a good chase!

[WashingtonBay]

You sayin' my beagle is slow? :)

[shewasmyshadow]

LOL. They are so cute! Did you ever find out if they were whethered (neutered) or not? That might be good to get done when they're young. It will keep the butting behavior down and also the mounting of it's playmate or anything else that might happen to be in the pen. ;)

[WashingtonBay]

They aren't neutered. We might... we'll see! Is the only downside of not neutering the potential for musky smell?

[Tiz]

High stink, and the penchant for self entertainment.

[WashingtonBay]

OK - we'll see how it goes :D Wonder if my horse vet would do it on a farm call...

[Tiz]

I think, if they're young enough, goats go the rubber band route.

[WashingtonBay]

Oh dear... I don't like the sound of that.

[Equine_Woman]

It's very easy to do, my vet does it for like $7. . .but he actually slices and pulls without drugs. . . the rubber band sounds much better after you watch that!

And you don't want to leave them as bucks. They would be stinky, smelly and miserable without does. Not a big surgery and wethers are so sweet!

[WashingtonBay]

Aw geeze... I'll call my vet and see if there's some kind of kind option for my goatses! They're really coming around sweet, I hate to do that to the little guys! Maybe I will get some does and satisfy my primal urge to breed something with a few baby goats ;) I can tell right now, these two little guys aren't going to make a DENT in my weedeating problem.

Say - I have a question for you goat people though, I was going to take a pic of their little horn buds tonight when hubby's home to help hold 'em still. They both look a little raw in their nubs, like they might be bleeding a little. Now, they have been doing a lot of play head-butting each other and rubbing their heads on things... maybe that's causing it? Anything to worry about?

[Equine_Woman]

Aw geeze... I'll call my vet and see if there's some kind of kind option for my goatses! They're really coming around sweet, I hate to do that to the little guys! Maybe I will get some does and satisfy my primal urge to breed something with a few baby goats ;) I can tell right now, these two little guys aren't going to make a DENT in my weedeating problem.

Say - I have a question for you goat people though, I was going to take a pic of their little horn buds tonight when hubby's home to help hold 'em still. They both look a little raw in their nubs, like they might be bleeding a little. Now, they have been doing a lot of play head-butting each other and rubbing their heads on things... maybe that's causing it? Anything to worry about?

Nothing to worry about. The buds are probably just rubbing on each other. If you do get all goat breeder on us be sure to leave only one as a buck. They will fight pretty badly with two bucks (wethers and bucks fight too). Boy goats are worse than males of any species for being single minded. They would breed themselves to death if they could. .. annoying.

[WashingtonBay]

Oh great... the guy I bought them from said it'd be no big deal whether I neutered them or not. ;)

Course, this may be the kind of answers you get from ag exchange goat sellers ;)

[Pinky]

Cute :D.

...what're you going to do about the couch then? :)

[WashingtonBay]

Oh - we found one! Nice futon that will work real well :~)

[natisha]

I'd neuter them. Your whole place will smell like goat, plus you won't even want to touch them.
I got a used older goat that I had neutered before I brought him home. The home boy vet wanted to just throw him down & do it. I refused & he was sedated without problem. They will be much happier as wethers plus they won't have dangly things hanging past their hocks.
Check out the best age to do it though. Sometimes if they are done too young their penis will be too small & they can get blockages that require a partial amputation of the penis.
I have a goat vet so if you have any questions I would be happy to ask him for you.

[WashingtonBay]

I'll make some calls to my vets today and see what they offer. See how much these $30 goats are gonna cost me! :D

[WashingtonBay]

Well, vet visit will be $50 per goat to neuter... somewhere around $6 for shots... Didn't ask about worming, but I guess I should probably just bring a sample. There's no rush on this, IMHO, I think I'll wait till they're a little more tame and leash trained. Would be easier to do any after-care that way.

Here's what their little nubbins look like, that I was wondering if it's OK:

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It looks to me like Fili, the one on the left, has a bit more horn left on one side... Might that mean it's not completely done? I guess we'll see!

Men who stare at goats...

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And here's a goat who has got my hubby by the collar :D

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[Dakota Sunrise]

The horn nubs might just fall off. It looks like that already happened on the one side. Is the side that still has a little horn loose at all?
It shouldn't be anything to worry about unless the nubbins keep growing. Most likely they'll just fall off and everything will be fine. If their heads get a little bloody from the nubs falling off maybe just put a little swat or corona on the tender spot so the flies don't bother it.

[WashingtonBay]

OK - so if it all goes like it should, the nubs they still have may just fall or rub off like the ones that are gone?

[Dakota Sunrise]

OK - so if it all goes like it should, the nubs they still have may just fall or rub off like the ones that are gone?

Yep. I've seen it happen like that before, it's not unusual.
If that is the case they should be good to go- nothing to worry about.:) Just keep an eye on them to make sure the horns don't start to grow back and get bigger. If they do you'll just have to have the vet disbud them again. But that is unlikely since their other nubs already fell off on their own.

[Gypsy Rose]

Awwww! What cute little monsters! :)

[WashingtonBay]

Goats playing in goat heaven! We let them *out* into the yard for a bit tonight, to let them play on the rock walls. The edging around these is part of what I'd like them to *EAT*.

They goofed off and scampered all over. Hard to keep a goat on task so we can get pictures, they were just little blurs in a lot of them. ;)

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1364&pictureid=19135

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1364&pictureid=19136

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1364&pictureid=19134

[jeezitsjacki]

they are too cute, now I want a goat. You should get one of those little tykes play sets for them, I bet you could find a cheap one on craigslist...that would be too cute them climbling on one of those

[natisha]

Those sure are two lucky goats. I don't know how you do anything more than look at them, I could watch them all day.
I'd forgotten how much goats like to climb on rocks. Thanks for the pictures. A video would be fun too.

[Dakota Sunrise]

Awe, great pics.:D I wish we had more rocks for ours to climb on. We have to make do with two big tractor tires, a little tykes play thingy (we removed the slide for safety reasons), and there's also two logs (that can't roll so it's safe for them to play on them) in their pasture.:p

[JetLagaside]

Look at those happy little monsters! Just to cute :)

[WashingtonBay]

More playing on the rock walls last night, and my goofy Wicket who I think has seen too many nature shows about lions taking down big game. She's fascinated by them... she's even in the background of the last one :)



And a goat-constitution question. Last couple of mornings when I go out to the barn to let them out of their stall and into their little pen, the goats have been just waking up. And one of them or the other has walked around and squatted a bit before being able to poop. Once started, the poop seems to come out freely (like a Vegas slot machine on a Jackpot), but it seems their systems sometimes take a bit to get 'going'. Is this a sign of something off about their diet? Too much of something, not enough of something else? They're eating grass, weeds, some hay and straw when in the stall, and handfuls of horse grain here and there, which is a combo of COB and pellets. Do they need something 'goat approved'? - Some kind of bran? Or is it not a big problem as long as the system does in fact get 'going' in short order once they move around?

[WashingtonBay]

More goat play pictures... The goats can now be with the dogs, ...

Barkley has settled down and doesn't chase and beller at them any more... but he's still very interested in them... Not as a meal, and I don't think he's particularly 'guarding' them, though he looks like he is... but rather, he's discovered they are nifty little mobile gum-ball machines :p:D

[oursarge]

They are SO CUTE!!!!! If I had them here I think I'd want to watch them all day long, they are so comical!

[Petra]

Oh they are adorable!
LOL @ "gumball machines" That was funny!

Thanks for the pictures!

[natisha]

Those pictures are great.
Do they have a free choice white salt block? They also sell a goat mineral block.
Some men are slow to start up too as evidenced by reading material in bathrooms. I don't know if that is normal or not for goats. My goat is a girl, if that even matters, & they just roll on out. Maybe DakotaSunrise will know?

[WashingtonBay]

I haven't seen a lot of that morning difficulty lately... maybe it was a passing thing from something they ate those days. They've been doin fine since.

They have a horse/livestock salt mineral available... a block (unknown block that was here when we moved in) and some loose salt mineral I bought and gave them... it's in this pic. Think that's OK? They've sampled it ... little bits at a time. They didn't make those big indents... horses did.

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8266&d=1276462025

[Suzi]

OMG i just saw this today, and I WANT ONE! They are too too cute. Are they good abt coming in at night, or when you need to put them up? I'd worry they'd wander off. I'd love to see some video too.

[WashingtonBay]

They're fenced in the yard, so they can't wander off...

I saw a coyote yesterday in the upper pasture in daylight, not sure if it was a chance sighting or if they're coming closer because of the goats. But I definitely wouldn't want them loose, and they'll be in every night.

It's not hard to get them to come in at all, they come running for a grain bucket, and they'll nearly climb my leg to get it. :D :)

Gallopin' goats!

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8328&stc=1&d=1277254956

[vicklynn]

Fooood, she has foooooood!
how cute!

[natisha]

WB, a plain white salt block would be better for them as the mineral block has copper in it. While excessive copper is more of a danger to sheep copper poisoning can happen with goats if it reaches toxic levels. You have no way of knowing when too much has happened until they get sick. Copper has to be 10:1 with molybdenum (whatever that is).
Play it safe & just give them salt. Wouldn't want anything to happen to our rock goats. :)

[WashingtonBay]

OK - will get a plain block next time I'm at the feed store. :)

[Horseaholic]

I don't think I've commented here yet but I absolutely love these goats! It's like you've gotten 2 new children! They're so fun to look at lolol

[WashingtonBay]

Monsters!
Today:

[natisha]

They're getting closer :p Pretty soon you'll have a poop deck ;)

The brown legged one seems to be the leader.

[WashingtonBay]

He is... much bolder than the other one. I'd call him completely tame now, I can touch him all over, he will literally climb up me to get in a bucket I'm holding. The other one is still a little more timid.

They have an appointment to get tutored on Monday. Could have done it before the weekend, but we've got company coming and it would be more fun for everyone if they weren't wounded little soldiers for the guests!

[Suzi]

Goat tutor? Is that for manners and such? Can they be trained at all, like to pull a small cart?

[oursarge]

Where there is trouble it seems goats will find it! When my brother in law had them they were little terrors. One somehow jammed itself in the rabbit coop and I had to get it out! They also liked to climb on cars. I thought they were funny! He eventually had to give them back to the lady he got them from because they kept getting out of the fence [A high fence] and he was afraid they'd get hit in the road. I missed them, they were so cute and I can't have any of my own so I'd play with his. He has donkeys and I guess they are supposed to keep the bob cats and coyotes away. We don't have donkeys and I'd be terrified something would get them.

Yours are just adorable.

[WashingtonBay]

Goat tutor? Is that for manners and such? Can they be trained at all, like to pull a small cart?

Heh... no (well, maybe but) this kind of tutored ;)

http://pic.pbsrc.com/spacer.gifhttp://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk272/dogpictures105/Tags%2003/goingtogettutored.jpg

[Suzi]

oh....oh...ouch

They would look cute pulling alittle cart....

[Horseaholic]

Goat tutor? Is that for manners and such? Can they be trained at all, like to pull a small cart?

lmao I must say I googled "goat tutoring , goat tutor, goat tutored " :hysterical: I just assumed it meant neutered hahaha but couldn't figure out why they called it that. I'm glad I wasn't the only one confused.

[Toodlestoo]

I love that Farside cartoon! They are adorable--hope everything goes well on Monday. :)

[WashingtonBay]

I guess it was too obscure of a reference for some? ;)

[Horseaholic]

do they "geld" goats or do they get tutored ;) ? ya know...proper terminology

I realllyy don't want goats but I must say that this thread kinda makes me want one...everyone keeps saying prado needs a goat. If he's as rough on a goat as his is on Astro I'm scared to get a goat.

[WashingtonBay]

Don't ask me if there's a proper term, everything I know about goats I learned in the last week :D

I think they're neutered, not gelded, and the geldings are called wethers ;)


And I haven't turned my goats loose with the horses, and I'm not sure I ever will. They're just so tiny. Bay looked kind and guardian-ish with them through the fence, all gentle-like, but Cyn looked like she'd go after them.

[HorseloverLee]

Some horses will go after smaller animals. When I was much younger the farm that I lived near had horses and cattle and more than once the horses attacked the calves. Maybe
the horses thought they were playing but I'm sure the calves didn't agree. I never saw a calf get really hurt but I really don't think it was a good idea for them to be together.


Also I just found this maybe it will be helpful to some people. http://goat-link.com/content/view/24/83/

[Dakota Sunrise]

Don't ask me if there's a proper term, everything I know about goats I learned in the last week :D

I think they're neutered, not gelded, and the geldings are called wethers ;)




Yep, you're pretty much right. Male goats get wethered (the goat version of gelded) and then are called wethers.:)

[WashingtonBay]

I'm uploading a short video of them being cute now... takes FOREVER on this connection. I'm glad I didn't edit together a long one!

[WashingtonBay]

Here's the little video.

They were hyper goats this morning, runnin' all over the place. I took a few more short clips but can't edit them together right now... So I just picked a bit. :)

YouTube- Happy Goats!

[natisha]

Adorable. Poor Barkley isn't sure what to do with them.

[WashingtonBay]

Nor they him ;)

[natisha]

What do the other dogs think of them?

[WashingtonBay]

They mostly ignore them. Everyone gets a little excited if they start running around real fast... like maybe they'd make good sport...:innocent:

I wish they cared more about them, honestly. I'm sorry now that we gave away that Aussie Shepherd to the neighbor. None of these have any herding dog in 'em. Just bird dogs! There's coyotes around, even during the day I worry about them when they're out and I'd like a dog that would watch over them a bit more. Barkley follows them around, but he's not guarding them as much as he is viewing them as little mobile random gum-ball dispensers.

[oursarge]

They're so funny, they sure have no problems on the rocks. They're adorable. I'm not sure but I think Rhonda [Gliderider] has a Great White Pyranese [sp], they are supposed to be good dogs to watch over a farm. Donkeys are supposed to be real good too. The stable has donkeys, so does my brother in law. Noah was a Border Collie Mix and I don't think he'd run anything off, there was a bob cat behind the house one night and Noah and my man were pushing each other out of the way to get back in the house!!!! I think Noah won!

[Rabid_Raccoon]

Aw, cute video. They're adorable when they run :)

A note about turning goats out with horses- have you ever heard of horses that "goat toss"? I believe it was in the movie Seabiscuit, and there's a horse at the barn I work at that will do it if turned out with goats or minis. It's where the horse picks them up (usually by the mane or neck) and litterally tosses them through the air.

A little off topic, but I just thought I would mention that since Michelle was talking about Prado possibly being too rough with a goat :P

I can't get over how cute these two guys are :)

[natisha]

They're so funny, they sure have no problems on the rocks. They're adorable. I'm not sure but I think Rhonda [Gliderider] has a Great White Pyranese [sp], they are supposed to be good dogs to watch over a farm. Donkeys are supposed to be real good too. The stable has donkeys, so does my brother in law. Noah was a Border Collie Mix and I don't think he'd run anything off, there was a bob cat behind the house one night and Noah and my man were pushing each other out of the way to get back in the house!!!! I think Noah won!:hysterical: And where were you?

[oursarge]

I was in the house trying to shut my cat Misty up, when that bob cat was screeching Misty was sitting near the window just screeching right back. It was spooky. I can tell you I didn't go outside without a big flashlight and 10 flood lights for a very long time!!!! The bear was hanging around then too and he didn't bother me as much as the cat!!! The cat can jump the fence, the bear might be able to but not as easy as the cat! He wasn't scared either, you hear that they are more scared of us than we are of them. Too bad nobody told him that because he had no fear in him!!!! I wish I had a video of the 2 of them pushing each other out of the way to get back in the house! It really was spooky though with Misty screaming back at that big cat! I was so happy when it finally wandered off!

[natisha]

I was in the house back. It was spooky. I can tell you I didn't go outside /I wish I had a video of the 2 of them pushing each other out of the way to get back in the house! Sing along time!
Stand by your man :p

[oursarge]

He was standing alone that night and knew if I had to save someone it would be Noah!!! My poor man, he always says he comes in 11th after all the animals!!! I do love him it's just that he doesn't get much attention when the animals need it! He's way down on the list again, poor Sarge's eye flared up again, I hope the ointment works as good this time as it did last time.

[WashingtonBay]

Today is goat tutoring day... late this afternoon... wish me luck on getting them into the truck, wish them luck on their procedure :)

[oursarge]

Good Luck! Hope they are good little goats.

[WashingtonBay]

Well, that was traumatic! For them, and for me.

The neutering was better than the de-horning. They both needed to be re-dehorned. That was awful to do. The vet shot them with some lidocaine, but I don't think it helped much, the poor guys, their little heads were in this head lock device thing, with me trying to hold them still, while they screamed while he held this hot iron on their heads. After all that, and just feeling awful about it, the neutering part went much quicker and with much less drama.

They're put in their stall, with a big clump of fresh cut blackberry vines and a soft straw bed. Not sure that's going to make up for the burn at both ends. They seem in good spirits though, better than me.

[Horseaholic]

oh no :( my stomach hurts reading that...I prob would have broken down and cried and made him stop.
Is that how it always goes?

[WashingtonBay]

Well, I'll hear from the other experienced goat owners if it sounds normal to them! They have burns on their heads now about the size of a quarter. Fili has a bit of a bloody stump on one side, the others look like burned scabs. I can still smell the burning hair and horn.

He asked if I was going to be OK to help hold them, since they were short staffed in the front of the clinic, and I said I'd do the best I can.

[WashingtonBay]

I was questioning myself whether it was really necessary after he described the process to me before hand, but I can see now that it had to be done... he said since their horns tip backwards, they get their head through something like field fence, and they get stuck, they can't get their head out and they wreck the fence, but since they're so small, they often can't fight their way loose, they're just stuck there.

Here's one with horns...

http://www.goatpet.com/Types-of-Goats/Nigerian-Dwarf-Goat.jpg

So, it needed to be done, but I wish they'd have been knocked out. That too, he said is dangerous for goats though.

[oursarge]

Poor babies, it sounds very traumatic. I don't know anything about goat care but I would be in tears after that especially if they were screaming, we can only hope they were doing that because they were scared and not hurting. When Puppy goes to the vet she sounds like she's being killed and they are only checking her heart or what ever, she SCREAMS people in the waiting room must think she's getting killed. Maybe it is like that for the goats. Hope they are OK, hugs all around. I think I'd need double Xanax, I think I do just reading that, I don't think I could stand it I'd probably faint.

[WashingtonBay]

It was a hot iron, I don't think it was just fear, it really hurt. Vet just said that goats don't do anesthesia well and this was really better. They do seem in awfully good spirits now, even head-butting each other a bit fighting over a bit of grain, though it made me cringe, they don't seem to be hurting badly now.

[oursarge]

Glad they don't seem to be hurting and hopefully forgot their traumatic experience. They are so adorable. The girl who cuts our hair used to have goats. I know they can be sensitive to certain things and she'd have to watch that they didn't eat things that would make them sick. They were always so cute watching us walk in the house, they'd line up to watch us and call to us. I wanted to goat nap them. Hugs to your babies.

[carla]

OMG WHAT a cute video! Barkley TOTALLY says, "you're lucky Mom is holding me off.." :hysterical:

Poor babies.. glad they seem to be feeling better now! :)

[Equine_Woman]

All mine have horns and we haven't really had a problem with it. My oldest girl broke both of hers off this year though and that was pretty traumatic! We don't have a problem with horns in the fence because they are in horse fencing (the little rectangle kind). Horn removal is rough! My step-grandmother used to do it all by herself on all the babies. I was always afraid they'd get brain damage. . . none did. And as for goats and anesthesia, I've had two go through an emergency c-section and they did just fine, but they wouldn't neuter my older buck because they said he'd probably just bleed to death. Surprisingly goat veterinary knowledge is just not very advanced at this time. Likely because there is no financial gain to being a goat vet, and certainly no financial gain to researching goat veterinary needs. . .

[WashingtonBay]

Very true EW... If you'd have told me yours all have their horns I might have thought twice about doing it. Awful thing.

Vet said he does anesthesia on goats when it's really necessary, like if they need to be cut open or stitched up in a bad place, but that they can just 'die' under anesthesia... and he's not had one die without it on these procedures.

Hopefully now, no more awful things. Just happy goat things.

[vicklynn]

Just read your vet visit. Id of had to of had one of the vet techs hold them. Id of been a mess hearing that.
I hope your babies are doing ok.
Are you over it yet?

Very cute goats by the way.

[WashingtonBay]

They seem fine this morning... Poor little guys. I'll be fine as long as they continue to look chipper and none-the-worse-for-wear. I feel bad for their little sore bits, but I'm trying to not turn that into too much hand-fed grain to make up for it. I took some pics while feeding breakfast this morning...

They'll be kept inside today, so I'm letting them have their stall and the aisle too to move around a bit without moving too much. And I cut them a large clump of berry bushes to nibble on today. I cut one last night too and that was a very popular thing, they stripped it :) They're not interested in it yet because they're still cleaning up the grain I 'spilled' during breakfast, but they will be. :)

8350 8351 8352 8353 8354

I should have taken a pic of their stall set up too... I forgot... they have a whole horse stall with straw on one half, just the rubber mats on the other, and a large dog crate they can play in and on... they seem to sleep in there most nights.

[WashingtonBay]

Well, they stripped that bunch of berry vines, and are well on their way to stripping a second big clump. I'd let them outside, but I should keep them quiet today he said, and I wonder if it's not too sunny... a burn's a burn, and perhaps their little heads would hurt in the sun if they were out. They seem to be doing fine, though I am still a bit traumatized by the whole thing.

I really didn't think I was a shrinking violet where farm animal handling and care were considered... but I just feel really bad for the little guys. I guess I'm a little surprised that farm animals all over the country, world really, are treated this way (the burning off of the horns and the neutering without even a local), with less or even no pain management at all (these guys did at least get a local on their heads and a shot of banamine), and no one really sees it as cruelty, but have a cat de-clawed, under full anesthesia, and everyone thinks you're a big meany.

It's just a hard world out there... for a couplea little goats. I don't think I could do this again!

Dakota.... how do you do it?

[Tiz]

No number(nummer)for the boy parts?! Rubber bands sound pretty good right now! Yikes.

[natisha]

WB, you'll be glad when they don't get horns. I have a scar in my leg where a goat impaled me, it bled for 3 days. My used goat has horns & it very much limits her social skills, plus she's already crazy.
As for the screaming goats scream at the drop of a hat. Mine does if she's even held for hoof trimming, grooming any time she doesn't get her way.
Your guys will be fine.

[WashingtonBay]

No numbing on the boy parts at all!

We talked about the rubber band thing... he said they're far too old for that to work, and that this way, waiting that long, is actually preferable because their little penises don't develop if they are done too early and they can be more susceptible to blockages.

[WashingtonBay]

As for the screaming goats scream at the drop of a hat. Mine does if she's even held for hoof trimming, grooming any time she doesn't get her way.
Your guys will be fine.

I know they scream for no reason. But they did actually have a hot iron pressed on their little heads. They weren't just being dramatic. ;)

[Tiz]

Well...glad WashingtonBoy wasn't there!

[WashingtonBay]

So is he. I told him about it, he just offered me a drink.

I have always regretted not going in to veterinary school... but maybe I couldn't have hacked it. I mean... for starters I don't even like needles.

[oursarge]

You're a good goat mother! I don't even drink and I think after that experience I would have finished off a bottle of something. I couldn't handle it. They are just the cutest little things. All the goats I know have horns I didn't even know they got cut off.

[Equine_Woman]

No number(nummer)for the boy parts?! Rubber bands sound pretty good right now! Yikes.

I know!!! I can't take them in to do the boy parts! It's horrid!! My son went with my husband to have our boy done (Lucky) and he can do a pretty good imitation of how horrible poor lucky thought it was. The band is much nicer it seems. You can band their horns off as well but it's hard to get them on there to stay!

I agree it's not a good thing to be a farm animal.

[WashingtonBay]

Well, hopefully from now on they'll live the goat dream life. They're tough little buggers, I'll grant them that. They've tolerated treatment that would leave me in a fetal position, assuming, of course, I even had the bits that were forcibly removed from them in the first place ;)

They're out grazing in the yard and seem perfectly happy out there. they particularly like the rather scrubby weedy things that grow in the driveway. That's a good thing.

[Tiz]

They choose weeds and blackberries over grass? Excellent!

I can handle vet type stuff, but something about a tranquilized horse makes me want to pass out. No vet school for me either.

[WashingtonBay]

They don't seem to like nice soft short green lawn grass all that much. They like the tall stuff with seed heads on it. They like dandelions and crab grass and weeds. They like blackberries, they're eating a blackberry vine that is intertwined inside a lilac, which they shouldn't eat, and don't appear to like. That part is pretty cool.

[Horseaholic]

ohh myyy those pics just gave me a whole new terrible visual . No goats for me.

[Dakota Sunrise]

Dakota.... how do you do it?

Well, um... not like that.:o

I've never expereinced what you and your babies just went through. I've never had any of my goats wethered. I do own a wether, but he came to me as an adult so I have no idea how his procedure was done. Maybe it's better that I don't know. I had no idea it would be so traumatic.:(

As for the disbudding, we always took our babies to the vets office when they were pretty young, just a couple weeks old (the sooner you do the less likely it is that the horns will grow back). We dropped them off in the morning with a bubba (= baby bottle of milk) for lunch and then they'd call us a few hours later to come pick them up. They'd be very quiet and kind of dopey, which I thought was from whatever meds they gave them to numb their heads. They'd go home and sleep for a while and be back to their normal bouncy selves the next day.

Since your kids already had been disbudded once it's good that you did it again if the horns were growing back. The problem with just letting them grow back is that they don't always come back normally. I've seen goats with only one horn, or horns that were two different heights, and even horns that were growing back so weird that they were actually curling backwards like they were going to grow back into his head. Not good at all.:(

Now, having goats with horns in general isn't always a bad thing. I've had my share of goats with horns, own some right now actually. Although all of my keepers--with the exception of two pygmies that were given to me--are disbudded. But, the problems with having horned goats are A.) it's very easy for them to get stuck in the fence. B.) Much more likely for them to hurt another goat when fight & headbutting- horn to the eye, bloody heads, etc. I've even seen goats get a leg stuck inbetween another's horns and then get flipped over. C.) If you want your goats to wear collars, having horned goats is VERY dangerous. I learned that the hard way years ago and I don't think I'll ever forgive myself for it.

[WashingtonBay]

Well, I bet it was still traumatic for the babies, you just weren't there. Probably much better when they are young like that though. I think my vet did an extra large and deep burn because it was a re-do. It's harder to try to fix a failed one than do it right the first time. Maybe your vet does do some anesthesia. Mine said he used to knock them out for procedures, but had trouble with goats dying from the anesthesia. He said it still hurts when they wake up, there's no way round it... it's still a burn... it smarts. But even still, like yours, luckily mine seemed no worse for the experience, once it was over.

Of course, it helps they can't talk. But they seemed chipper. More chipper than I would be.

I have always heard that prey animals just don't feel pain as acutely as we do. That to survive, they must be able to function and keep running, even when really hurt. Much more vital for a prey animal than for a carnivore. Carnivores are relative wimps about pain. They can stop. That's true. I know it's true for horses. They'll endure injuries that would have us in a fetal position.

[Dakota Sunrise]

Well, I bet it was still traumatic for the babies, you just weren't there.

Don't tell me that.:( I don't want to know that.

I'm hoping our vet did knock them out to do it. I always thought he did. They always seemed so dopey when we picked them up. But I could be wrong. I guess when you assume...:o


(((Hugs))) to your babies! I'm glad they're feeling better now.

[FlapJack]

I'm sorry, that sounds really hard. I don't know how I would have managed watching that either. I don't know anything about goats, it's hard to imagine there not being a better way but you'd think someone would have thought of it if there were. At least it's over now! They are adorable and lucky goats :)

[WashingtonBay]

More pressing problem for these goats is that they won't go out in the rain, or when the grass is wet. Do they know where they live? I let them out of their stall and had to close it or they'd run back in. They huddle in the lean-to and only nibble what they can reach without getting their feet wet. :rolleyes:

Brush pile in foreground is the pile from my recent pine-tree-ectomy, not cleaned up yet.

[oursarge]

They're like Puppy, she hates getting her feet wet!!!! They are adorable. I am glad they are over their traumatic experience. I'm not, just reading it was upsetting, can't imagine seeing it.

[Dakota Sunrise]

I'm not surprised that they hate the rain.:rolleyes: It's a goat thing.:p

[WashingtonBay]

And what am I supposed to do with them October through May? :) Are they intending to stay inside?

[jeezitsjacki]

hey them little jackets and booties!! haha

[natisha]

And what am I supposed to do with them October through May? :) Are they intending to stay inside?Yes
I gave my goat a bath when I first got her, she screamed like I was killing her. Her coat when wet looked crimped & curly-weird

[Petra]

They are adorable. I loved the video. :)

WB, I wouldn't worry too much about the traumatic experience. You were very right - animals have much higher pain tolerance than people. You canot try to imagine what they felt, because they didn't feel it the way you would, if you got burned. I'm sure they screamed more out of fear than pain.

[Dakota Sunrise]

And what am I supposed to do with them October through May? :) Are they intending to stay inside?

Most likely.:cool: It's a goat thing- they hate rain.

[WashingtonBay]

Goat-date! Goats are not only wimps about the cold and rain, they're wimps about the heat as well.... they've been in the barn much of the day, in the aisle, laying on the cold concrete.

But they came out to check out Bay when I had him in the yard for a hose-down. They're remarkably curious about him. :)

[RipSpark]

They are so adorable!

We dehorned our goat and are so glad we did. A friends goat died getting its head stuck in a fence and I saw one at the barn gets its horned ripped off in the stall. It almost died. Prior to that she had gotten her horn stuck in her horses halter and was being spun in circles. We got Gracie's done with the string. There was screaming and blood but not too bad.

I know goats are supposed to be hardly weed eating machines but let me tell you Gracie is not lol.

You can leave her stall open and she won't step out if it is raining. If she does have to go out she shakes her body and acts very offended. I can give her a bath though....and she is great. She bloats if she is out too long so she spends a good bit of time in her stall and out in a paddock with not too much to eat. In the summer she pants and lays down looking exhausted. I try to keep her out of the sun as much a possible. I don't think all of her fat helps either(looks like she has several watermellons poking out of her belly). She is 8 years old though so I think she is doing well :) Not sure what the average goat age is.