What would you do about horse refusal?

[Toodlestoo]

My hubby and I were taking the big boys for a trail ride last week. He was on Jack and I was on Oreo. They walked very nicely through our big pasture to get to the woods. They were great in the woods and I was leading. As we were coming out to go into a neighbor's pasture with very high grass, Oreo refused to go any further. I prodded him to go on with my foot and he bucked!:rolleyes: What is really funny is that he is so fat, he only got his rear end up about a foot but I digress--anywho, I circled him and tried to enter again and his ears were flat back and he would not budge. So, hubby said he would lead with Jack. Same darn thing. Jack would not go in!:mad: So, now I'm thinking there may be something in the grass they are afraid of so we turned around and went back into the woods. We come to another pasture with high grass and they walk right in.

Sorry it took so long to get to the question but I know you are not supposed to give in to bad behavior, so were we wrong not to force them into the field? We haven't ridden again to see what their response would be this time. I have to admit I was scared being on such a huge horse. Should I have gotten off and led him through? The trouble with that is he is so tall, I never would have gotten back on. :cry: Any advice for this type of situation would be greatly appreciated.

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/picture.php?pictureid=291&albumid=41&dl=1223332996&thumb=1 (http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/album.php?albumid=41&pictureid=291) http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/picture.php?pictureid=292&albumid=41&dl=1223333052&thumb=1 (http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/album.php?albumid=41&pictureid=292)

[Mercury]

On trails I have a tendency to trust my horses more than my own sight. I would have done what you did and gone somewhere else, especially with a seasoned horse. I was taking a bunch of beginners on a trail ride in the bad lands and my horse wouldn't go into this one area. I managed to find a way to go around it. When I got back I had another wrangler go check it out and he found a rattler den...

Another time we just had a rain and I wanted to cross a small river. Normally it's about knee high on the horses. My horse wouldn't go through. One of the guys managed to get his draftx through but the current was really strong and there were several drop offs. My little 14 hh guy wouldn't have been able to get me safely across.

[WashingtonBay]

Working through issues like that takes trust... Sounds like they are just green and in an unfamiliar place. Or maybe there was something there... who knows. They have to be able to trust you when you say it's safe to go, and you have to trust your skills to make them go and handle any outbursts. Both of those take time and miles and experience to build with a horse.

If you aren't sure of either one, I'm not one to tell you it's a bad idea to get off and lead them past the booger, whatever it is. Check it out... make SURE it's safe for them. It's certainly better than risking getting dumped on your butt far from home, though it doesn't sound like the bucks are a real challenge ;) the next stage might be, and my over-all rule is keep yourself safe. And it's certainly better to verify it's safe before you tell them something that's not true.

If you can do that from the saddle on these horses, great. But if you push something you aren't ready for and LOSE you're further behind than if you would have just led them.

[cloedoll]

I probably would have done the same thing. Whenever I would trail ride in Hawai'i, I remember all three horses that were on the trail ride just stopped dead in their tracks, ears forward and they were very alert. Turns out, there was a wild bull, if we would have continued going that way, who knows what would have happened. So, I really like to listen to my horse, I think their instincts are a bit more in tune their ours. ;) However, I would think if he thought/knew something dangerous was in there, he would have pranced around, ears forward and been more scared, not acting stubborn (bucking, ears back). So, I dunno on this one. I shall wait to see other's replies. :)

[walkinthewalk]

All good thoughts, but I ditto Mercury.

Many years ago, I was trail-riding my cousin's new horse along the lake in late August, when it was really low. I was 15 and while pretty seasoned by that age, still lacking in street-smarts.

The mare refused to cross what appeared to be dry ground where the lake had gone down. I pushed her forward anyway and she sunk --- up to her belly.

Thankfully I was riding bareback, so no saddle to weight her down. I got off her as she laid down as if to give up -- I only sunk to the tops of my tennis shoes.

I went to the edge of the woods and found a long stick, walked back to her, grabbed the end of her reins and proceeded to holler as loud as I could while whapping her butt with the stick.

It scared her enough to where she sat up and made a final huge lunge that got her out of the quagmire.

I still have never been as scared as I was that day and it was a HUGE LESSON LEARNED to trust the horse more than yourself.

If I am riding a green horse, I am always careful to ride it in places where I know for fact it is safe; that way if the horse balks, I know that I need to keep encouraging it.

If a seasoned horse is doing some major balking for no apparent reason - the odds are good that the rider just can't see danger lurking and maybe never will -- go around or back track:)

[Diane of Buck's Hollow]

Just my thoughts as I was reading your post.

I think I would trust the horse in this situation, especially since the other horse would not go also. Then...they both went into the other pasture with the tall grass.

The thing with me and Buck is ..he keeps letting me know how much he trust me....and I just am not there yet with him. I should be though. It isn't him.. it's me. He seems to always take care of me.

Anyway, in saying this....If I had any reservations about the safeness of the situation..I would turn around. For both me and my horse.

[Diane of Buck's Hollow]

Oh no..walking...How scary that is. Thank God you could think of something to do to get yourself out of that situation.

[lisakaye]

Brutus has done that to me few times on a trail and it has always turned out to be something he saw and I didn't. I trust him he sees more than I do .

[SedonaThunder]

WTW - that is a VERY scary story and I can't even imagine how you felt. I met a girl on a trail ride who had a similar experience - convinced her horse to walk into a lake not knowing someone had dumped a mattress out there that was rotting. Her mare's hooves and shoe got hung up on it and she thrashed and such until she too laid down to give up with just her head out of the water. Her rider had to run 1/2 mile to the nearest road (covered in mud and gunk) and start trying to flag down cars... most ignored her as she looked like a scary crazy person. Finally someone pulled over and then another - and with the help of these two strangers she was able to get her horse out of there. If I can't see the bottom of the lake/river/stream I will not go into it - I'm terrified now.

As for the grass crossings - my horses do the very same thing if deer or elk have been bedded down on a particular trail we go on. I usually make them circle and then try again - usually after two or three "circling sessions" they decide it's easier to go forward through the grass trail... if not - I get down and walk them through.

[vicklynn]

I dont have time to read all the responses, so here is mine.

Your horse refused one tall area but not the other. You could not see if there was something in either field. Im thinking the horse may of sensed something and it was best that you let it lay. Normally I would push, but only if I can see if there is an issue. If I cant see it(denseness in field), my horse senses it, then I figure the horse knows best, if only for our safety, I will go another route.

Love those horses, beauts.

[mtnmollie]

I had a refusal and I thought, "What if there is a bear? " and there was a bear- LOL.

We went left insead of straight. Then I saw the bear. :eek:

Bear was the reason for the refusal- but we were safe- because I listened to my horse.
It was a guessing game at the time... thou.

Useally I get off and lead them, and I am glad I did not meet bear on foot. Eek.

[mtnmollie]

All good thoughts, but I ditto Mercury.

If a seasoned horse is doing some major balking for no apparent reason - the odds are good that the rider just can't see danger lurking and maybe never will -- go around or back track:)

Yes. I agree. My bear encounter was with a green horse useally equals guessing game.

You dont want to reward the wrong behavior. When my dogs are with me they useally clear the field around me. Some things like rattlers and wolves my dogs can't handle though.

[walkinthewalk]

I had a refusal and I thought, "What if there is a bear? " and there was a bear- LOL.

We went left insead of straight. Then I saw the bear. :eek:

Bear was the reason for the refusal- but we were safe- because I listened to my horse.
It was a guessing game at the time... thou.

Useally I get off and lead them, and I am glad I did not meet bear on foot. Eek.

Ho-lee Mo-lee!:eek:

Many years back, my "hunting" friends and I were riding in the Allegheny National Forest near their grandmother's camp. All of the horses suddenly got hyped and started snorting. We didn't see the bear but we sure did see the steaming-fresh bear dung:eek:

I say my "hunting" friends, because they were three sisters and their aunt who had hunted those hills all their lives and got us lost --- you should've heard that cat fight, of which I kept my non-related mouth shut:rolleyes:

We luckily ran across a fisherman who was kind enough to point us on our way out. We ended up ten miles down the road from camp and it was getting dark. No cell phones back then but thankfully the guys came looking for us in the truck and followed us to camp so no one would get rear-ended by a car:cowboy:

[mtnmollie]

I got lost with the backcountry Game Warden who grew up in the woods of Idaho and taught himself how to track. We spent the night on the ground. No supper. No breakfast next moring either. We got back to the horse trailer the second day at dark.

[Toodlestoo]

Thank you all for your replies! We've ridden that field before without a problem. There have been black bear sightings around here this summer so I guess that was in the back of my mind.:(

For me, I feel I did the right thing but I don't want to spoil him so that every time he doesn't want to do something, he tries his little "buck". If he ever gets that big butt of his off the ground, I'm in real trouble.:eek: I feel better that some of you feel that sometimes, you just need to trust your horse.

WTW--I can't imagine going through what you did! Talk about scary. And Vicklynn, thanks for the compliment. Could it be that you like black and white horses?:rolleyes: