Facing you while lungeing?

[zoel_222]

When my boss lunges a horse, everytime she has the horse halt, she pulls it in to face her and has it walk up to her. Now, I was always taught that when you're lungeing you want the horse to stand with his shoulder to you and DON'T want the horse to come into the circle. She worked with a boarder's pony for maybe 3 or 4 sessions, but since she doesn't have the time anymore the boarder and her agreed I could work with Ms. Pony. I've lunged her a few times before my boss started working with her and she never tried to turn into the circle. Now, this week, everytime I lunged her and asked her to stop she'd immediately turn in and try to walk up to me. I feel like she's invading my space because I did NOT ask her to walk up to me. Do I need to train her to stay outside the circle, or should I just go with it since that's how she was being trained? I feel bad for the poor girl because I train differently than my boss and I don't want to have to confuse her. I asked my boss why she did it that way and what it does for the horse and she says "That's the way Chris Irwin does it." :rolleyes: That's basically her answer for everything horse related, so I thought I'd ask you guys. Does anyone else lunge like that?

[Kaitlyn]

Uhh, I don't make them walk towards me. I see it as they are crowding my space and I HATE that. Although, I do like it when they stop and turn to me, but only if they can start to move out again. I have/had that issue with the gelding I work with, he would ALWAYS come in after I told him to stop because his owner would give him a treat. Drives me nuts!

[JackieB]

The horse definitely shouldn't come in until you invite it. Other than that, it's fine as long as the horse is invited and respectful. Where a lot of people get goofed up is they don't notice when the horse does something like this uninvited. If that happens, the human is relinquishing control to the horse without realizing it. Not good.

I invite Buster in at the end of every single lunging session. But, if he gets the idea on his own, I say "Hey! I didn't invite you in here yet." and I send him back out and around.

[zoel_222]

I will invite my horses in at the very end, but not every halt, or every time I want to switch directions. Another question :D why do you have them turn and face you?

[JackieB]

why do you have them turn and face you?

I don't know that it's important to have a horse turn and face you. Not sure about that. But I know it's very important to get them in the habit of keeping head and shoulders more toward the inside of the circle so that the hind legs are never facing you (kicking risk).

[TheBadLands]

It's an invite only, as everyone else said. I do prefer they face me at an angle and present a shoulder vs. presenting haunches. That's disrespectful. Because I lunge free in the round pen. They always whoa and face me and wait for either a direction change, or to be asked to come in. Same on the line. I expect them to look at me and wait for a command.

[oursarge]

It's an invite only, as everyone else said. I do prefer they face me at an angle and present a shoulder vs. presenting haunches. That's disrespectful. Because I lunge free in the round pen. They always whoa and face me and wait for either a direction change, or to be asked to come in. Same on the line. I expect them to look at me and wait for a command.


This is how I was taught to do it too. I also free lunge unless the round pen is in use then I use a line but mostly we free lunge everyone. I have heard of some people not wanting the horse to face them at all just stopping and staying where they are 'til the next command. I think that's how our mare was taught since she'd never face me. I thought she was ignoring me until I read someone else's view on lunging and they said the horse shouldn't face you? I don't know, but she faces me now but does not come into my space 'til invited. The boys are the same way.

[TheBadLands]

This is how I was taught to do it too. I also free lunge unless the round pen is in use then I use a line but mostly we free lunge everyone. I have heard of some people not wanting the horse to face them at all just stopping and staying where they are 'til the next command. I think that's how our mare was taught since she'd never face me. I thought she was ignoring me until I read someone else's view on lunging and they said the horse shouldn't face you? I don't know, but she faces me now but does not come into my space 'til invited. The boys are the same way.

I've gotten some in like that..others refuse to come into you based on fear.... I alter working them according to the individual horse.

EXAMPLE: When dealing with fear.. I want them to come to me and touch me. I find that working them in the pen, but on the line, and turning away from them gives them the confidence to come into you. Eventually you can work toward a bigger, more intricate goal with some finesse to it.

Whiskey is essentially a mustang, only worse, he has been untouched other than inhumane handling. So he has a deep seeded "flight" mechanic to him driven by general fear and combined with lack of human interaction.. when he came to me he literally almost lost his leg trying to evade my presence even though I was nowhere near him. This is an older video of him probably his first or second week with me. Now he works how I like them to. But I allow him to come into me if I turn my back or go low (crouch) because for him, it's a lot to ask.

Here's the video:

P1010259.flv video by realnaturalhorsemanship - Photobucket

It's a good example.

A "normal" horse can be taught from the start to work a certain way. But every horse is different.

[HeartofSteel]

It's an invite only, as everyone else said. I do prefer they face me at an angle and present a shoulder vs. presenting haunches. That's disrespectful. Because I lunge free in the round pen. They always whoa and face me and wait for either a direction change, or to be asked to come in. Same on the line. I expect them to look at me and wait for a command.

This is similar to how I do it. Niko faces me to look for what he's supposed to do next, he's not allowed to come up to me though. I will go to him and pat him but he's not to move his feet. He also knows how to stay facing sideways on the circle instead of facing, I think it's good for them to know both.

[WashingtonBay]

It's only disrespectful if the horse is stopping to face you instead of doing something else. :) It's not disrespectful if the horse thinks that's what she's supposed to do.

IMHO, whether the horse stops on the circle or comes in is preference of the trainer. Lots of times they will come in when first teaching "woah", simply because you can't really avoid it when your only correction will tend to pull them in. As I move them up to long lines and expect more precision, then you can teach them to stop ON the circle.

[FlapJack]

Jack has never been on a lunge line but he does circle around me off lead or on a lead rope sometimes. I've taught him that halt means stop and turn to face me - not come in to see me - just turn and face. I prefer it this way also because often when I am stopping him it is to make a change of direction, which I find easier to do when he is turned in my direction.

It would annoy me too if the horse walked right up to me everytime we halted.

[Palogal]

I will invite my horses in at the very end, but not every halt, or every time I want to switch directions. Another question :D why do you have them turn and face you?

They turn and face you as if to ask, "Yes, what would you like me to do now?" A horse should always have an eye and an ear on you when you're working with them. Turning in and walking toward you at every halt seems a little silly to me but there's nothing wrong with it. She probably likes to "send off" every time from the middle. Tomato- tomahto.

[zoel_222]

Ah ok. Thanks for the replies. :)

[TheBadLands]

Jack has never been on a lunge line but he does circle around me off lead or on a lead rope sometimes. I've taught him that halt means stop and turn to face me - not come in to see me - just turn and face. I prefer it this way also because often when I am stopping him it is to make a change of direction, which I find easier to do when he is turned in my direction.

It would annoy me too if the horse walked right up to me everytime we halted.

For me, like I said, I use that for horses with severe fear issues. It's a huge thing for them to approach you and touch you. Later on I teach them to stand and wait. Whiskey was so wild and so fearful, I sat with him for 6 hours a day, for 4 days before I could even get him to stretch out to eat hay out of my hand. So I took the coming into me as a BIG step for him. ;)

Palo: I'm the same. I like them to always be watching, listening or waiting intently to do something. Even when we're playing, they're still learning. And a small hole becomes a very big hole really quickly. So even when hand grazing, I will randomly ask them to back up, or turn on the haunches (they all do this without touch anyway).

[menagerie]

Hmmm, when I lunge mine he stops and faces me and only walks a step or two towards me at every halt. I like this as I feel like he's paying more attention to me and if I choose to I can walk out to him to praise and rub.

[TheBadLands]

Hmmm, when I lunge mine he stops and faces me and only walks a step or two towards me at every halt. I like this as I feel like he's paying more attention to me and if I choose to I can walk out to him to praise and rub.:cowboy:

I agree. Especially if they're mouthing at you. Then they're basically saying, "Hey! Which way, lady!?!"

[vicklynn]

I have my horses turn in when I stop them, not when changing direction, but I ask them to come in, otherwise they are to stay there. I have taught Myst, while free lunging, to cross the round pen twards me at a full trot. I have her stop, stay turned in, but planted, then I walk to the other side of the round pen, I click to her, for her forward motion, then tip my body forward and say ho, and she stops dead. Ill try to get a vid of it one day. City is slacking on his "dance" we do, its my fault though, Ill have to get him up to speed. I think Ive posted a vid of him sort of doing it though on horse.com.
As long as you have the respect of a horse, there are many things you can do, and yes, even have them come in to you when done. CA, CC does it, but only when the horses CAN get in your space(respect), not before.

[Flair]

A friend of mine has an Arabian who will stop, and turn and face her (and me) while free lunging. It drives me batty because I wouldn't be asking him to stop. So I have to get after him. I'm not sure if she lets him get away with it.

Mitch on the other hand is free lunged, and will continue to move in a circle until I bring him in with a signal, which is calling his name, telling him "Come" and doing a little hand gesture and a kissing sound. I think it's probably because I've worked so much with him on it, whereas I've only occasionally lunged the Arabian.

[Miracle Whip]

My gelding is trained to come in to the center, he only comes in if I ask for a halt. I am working on him learning voice cues, like walk and canter and I use them under saddle. He is a pretty energetic Tennessee Walker and walking is not something he does much of. I have never had a problem with him coming in to me. Usually it means he is ready to listen now, and I will ride him at that point. Rarely do I feel I need to lunge him longer. He comes in when I say whoa and sometimes on his own. Its not an issue for me and never has been.

I free lunge only.

The pony heads for the nearest corner when I ask her to whoa so its nice to have Whip come in and stand for me.

When I want him to change directions I say SWITCH and change my whip hand.

[Cat]

I've seen both methods utilized. It seems that more "english" type riding lends to the type of lunging where the horse circles around and when asked for a whoa it stops right where it is and does not turn in towards you. While a lot of western & natural horsemanship type training asks for the horse to turn the haunches away and face you. People can argue all day which one is "correct" but it really is a preference choice and sometimes what is "correct" is influenced by the discipline you prefer to ride.

Now I have never seen it thought as acceptable for the horse to come in to your space uninvited. That is asking for trouble, IMO. Its one thing if you cue them and invited them in - otherwise they should stay out on the circle.