What is a ration balancer and where can you find one?

[Peggy Sue]

What is a Ration Balancer?

They are generally forage-based, no grain pellets that are low in NSC and therefore safe to feed to horses that might be at risk for colic, laminitis, ulcers and other chronci digestive upset problems. They are nutrient dense and generally higher in most nutrients than most conventional feeds. But, they are more than just a vit/min supplement. They offer things like amino acids and prebiotics that are helpful in the digestion/utilization of other nutrients. They also generally contain some caloric value...around 1300 cal/lb....nearly that of some sweet feeds...but, of course, much less is fed.

Ration balancers are also more geared to complement your hay/pasture. Conventional feeds are generally formulated to the old NRC guidelines that provide RDAs that are not meant to sustain health and function, but rather to sustain life....IOW enough nutrients are provided to keep the horse from developing nutritional deficiencies that would ultimately result in death. However, ration balancers are formulated to provide more optimal nutrition...even for working horses and most companies have two formulations that complement either grass hays or alfalfa based diets. You will also note that the biggest difference between these formulations is the amount of protein provided (generally 20-30% for grass and 10% for alfalfa)....these numbers are more in keeping with the new NRC guidelines that recognize that we are not supplying enough protein in our horses diets. This combination of increased protein levels and complementary amino acids that are necessary to utilize the protein shows up on the outside in improved hoof, coat and skin quality....likewise there is improved interior health as well.

While being the ideal feed for easy and normal keepers, ration balancers also are easily complement with rice bran, BOSS, alfalfa pellets/cubs and beet pulp to provide extra calories for harder keepers. The improtant factor is that while you can control caloric intake, you are not altering nutritient intake like you would with conventional feeds. For example if you have an easy keeper and a hard keeper...convention feeding programs would most likely mean that you would limit feed intake for the easy keeper and increase it for the hard keeper...but at the same time, you are also altering nutrient intake in the same manner. Many times, it is this alteration in nutrient uptake that causes a horse to be an abnormal keeper...especially when it comes to hard keepers.

Ration balancers are also economical. Depending on what you feed as your conventional program, it can cost up to 2x as much per bag. However, you will probably feed at least 1/2 to much less than you have been feeding...thus making it no more...and most likely less to feed. Additionally, from my experience with ration balancers....you will also find that most or all of your supplements will no longer be necessary because the ration balancer contains many of the same things or more than what those supplements do....generally, there are no "gaps" to fill like there is with some conventional feeds.


Who make them and where do I find them at??

Buckeye Gro N WIn or ALf Gro N Win
http://www.buckeyenutrition.com/dealers.html (http://www.buckeyenutrition.com/dealers.html)

Tribute feeds Essential K
http://www.kalmbachfeeds.com/Dealers.php?zipcode=16143 (http://www.kalmbachfeeds.com/Dealers.php?zipcode=16143)

Front Runner 30% or 10% Supplment
http://www.frontrunnerhorse.com/ (http://www.frontrunnerhorse.com/)

McCauley's M30
http://www.mccauleybros.com/contact/dealer_locator.cfm

Kent Horsego12 or Horsego32
http://www.kentequine.com/Results.aspx (http://www.kentequine.com/Results.aspx)

LMF SuperSupplement
http://lmffeeds.com/cart/index.php?m...products_id=10 (http://lmffeeds.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=22&products_id=10)

Pennifield All Phase
http://www.pennfield.com/equinefeed/phaseFeeds.cfm (http://www.pennfield.com/equinefeed/phaseFeeds.cfm)

Progressive Pro Advantage grass or alfalfa formula
http://prognutrition.com/DealerLocator.htm (http://prognutrition.com/DealerLocator.htm)

Purina Enrich32 or Enrich12
http://horse.purinamills.com/dealerlocator/ (http://horse.purinamills.com/dealerlocator/)

Seminal Equalizer
http://www.seminolefeed.com/ProductS.../Equalizer.mht (http://www.seminolefeed.com/ProductSheetsforWeb/Equalizer.mht)

Triple Crown TC12% or TC30% supplement
http://www.triplecrownfeed.com/distributors.php (http://www.triplecrownfeed.com/distributors.php)


Brookes Feed All Phase
http://www.brooksfeeds.com/product04a.html (http://www.brooksfeeds.com/product04a.html)

ADM Allaince Nutrition Gro STrong
http://www.admani.com/AllianceEquine...lsVitamins.htm (http://www.admani.com/AllianceEquine...lsVitamins.htm)

TDI-30
http://www.tdihorsefeeds.com/product.asp#TDI-30 (http://www.tdihorsefeeds.com/product.asp#TDI-30)

Kalmbach Feeds http://www.kalmbachfeeds.com/Dealers.php
32% Horse Supplement Pels
34% Horse Supplement Pels
35% Horse Supplement Pels

[Dakota Sunrise]

Great thread, Peggy Sue! Thanks for the info.:)

[Arrow]

Here I was coming to say, "Ask Peggy Sue," not having read the topic starter! Great idea for an info. post!

[Peggy Sue]

I am hoping it willbe used as a "reference" type thread for those looking and wondering... there are more but I have to dig and find them again... I even have a couple for Aus just have to get the time to post the info

[Arrow]

I am hoping it willbe used as a "reference" type thread for those looking and wondering... there are more but I have to dig and find them again... I even have a couple for Aus just have to get the time to post the info

Exactly! Just what we need here!

[Gypsy Rose]

Great idea for a thread, PeggySue!

The only 2 drawbacks so far that I've found with RB's is that in some areas- mine included, there isn't enough awareness of what a RB is, or in some cases, even a multi vitamin/mineral supplement (at least the good ones, lol)! Therefore, sometimes, they're hard to locate. The other thing is, since I have a senior horse, I'm always on the hunt for better nutritional alternatives geared in that area. Unfortunately, the only RB company that I'm aware of that has a RB geared towards seniors is Triple Crown, which is not available in my area, lol! Therefore, those of us with Senior horses have less choice of what we feed our horses.

If anyone finds one other than Triple Crown, please let me know.

[Peggy Sue]

Buckeye has one :)

[Gypsy Rose]

He!he! Good to know, but does me no good- I live in Purina Land!

[moka]

So TB RB says that if you have to give additional "calories" to best give oats. Do you know why and would you? Or would you rather use something like beet pulp.

[Peggy Sue]

I have feed oats to boost BUT yuo will get a bit of extra energy with them ... I would perfer to use Beet Pulp or ALfalfa pellets close to same calories without the added starches

[Mandzanita]

Does Nutrena make one?

[Gypsy Rose]

I don't think so- but I'm not sure- I've contacted PeggySue- hopefully, she'll know!

[Mandzanita]

Thanks Gypsy!! :)

[Gypsy Rose]

Nope! Nutrena does have their Safe Starch Feed, but it's designed to be fed in high amounts, like regular feeds.

[Mandzanita]

So I have the choice of either LMF Super Supplement or Purina Enrich32 or 12 (I'm not sure which one I'd feed because I feed 1/2 alf. and 1/2 grass...the bigger flake is usually grass) Which one is better? I'm bummed I don't have a better variety in my area :(

[Gypsy Rose]

Gimme a bit- though I do know with the Enrich, you'd feed the 32 with mixed hay, especially if your percentage leans toward grass hay.

[Gypsy Rose]

I'd say go with the Enrich 32- the LMF doesn't have as nice a mineral profile, but that's just my opinion, lol!

They're both good products.

[Gypsy Rose]

Better yet, I'll give you the links to both, and you can compare the profiles:

LMF SuperSupplement
http://lmffeeds.com/cart/index.php?m...products_id=10 (http://lmffeeds.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=22&products_id=10)

Super Supplement you'd feed the G formula

Purina Enrich32 or Enrich12
http://horse.purinamills.com/dealerlocator/ (http://horse.purinamills.com/dealerlocator/)

[Mandzanita]

Thank you so much! :) I think I may go off your opinion and what I saw in the profiles and pic Enrich32. What texture is it? Pellet?

[Gypsy Rose]

Pelleted:

http://horse.purinamills.com/products/Enrich32.asp

[Peggy Sue]

check out the link for the TC30% you MIGHT be able to get it somewhere CLOSE ... if you have to choose between LMF and Purina I would call or email LMF nad ask for a more complete profile as well as an ingredient list... I dont' hav eeither on it :)

When feeding a mix of alfalfa/grass people seem to have better luck with the ones designed for grass hays like the Enrich32 or the TC30%

Sorry I have a new puter and all the uploads and updates has my server running at dail up speeds

Thanks Ann for stepping in!!

[HogWild]

Is anyone familiar with the Platform feeds offered at Tractor Supply? Supposedly, they were formulated by the lady over the Equestrian department at the University of Arkansas. I'm not sure if these would be classified as a Ration Balancer.

Their literature says the contain complex carbohydrates, fats and fiber with less simple sugars and starches than sweet feeds, to reduce nutritionally-related problems such as obesity, laminitis, and founder. It says it provides a complete nutritional foundation when fed with appropriate roughage and enhances the conversion of nutrients for maximum absorption.

The ingredients include flaxseed, beet pulp, distiller's grains, stabilized rice bran, antioxidants, chelated minerals, yeast supplement, and natural tocopherols. It literature also states that no additional grain, pelleted feedor vitiamin/mineral supplements are needed when fed the platform feeds - just quality hay or pasture.

It sounds like a godd feed......but I'm not sure it's a ration balancer since the recommended feed rate is 1/4 - 1/2 lb per 100 lbs of body weight for the Pleasure version which doesn't have lysine listed as an ingredient. The Sport & Performance version does have Lysine (0.60%) and recommends the following feed rates:

Adult Maintenance or light work - 0.20 - 0.50 lb/100lb body wgt
Moderate to hard work - 0.50 - 1.0 lb/100lb
Early to mid-gestation - 0.25 - 0.50 lb/100lb
Stallion in service - 0.75 - 1.0 lb/100lb

Is this different than a Ration Balancer?

[Gypsy Rose]

This would be considered a regular horse fed, based on the amounts fed. Here is an example of their Pleasure feed:

Platform Feeds - Pleasure

Pleasure • Sport & Performance (http://www.platformfeed.com/products_performancefeed.htm) • Mare & Foal (http://www.platformfeed.com/products_marefoalfeed.htm) • Senior (http://www.platformfeed.com/products_seniorfeed.htm) • Miniature Horse & Pony (http://www.platformfeed.com/products_minifeed.htm)

http://www.platformfeed.com/images/platform_pleasure.jpg

Platform Pleasure Horse Feed is designed for the adult horse whose activity level ranges from idle to lightly exercised. It’s a concentrated feed with higher fiber, lower starch, vitamins, minerals and 12% high quality protein. No additional grain, sweet feed, pellets or vitamin/mineral supplements should be fed with Platform Pleasure Horse Feed. The only additional feed he needs is quality hay or pasture.
Directions:
Feed Platform Pleasure Horse Feed at the rate of 0.25 to .75 lbs per 100 lbs. body weight, adjusting amount fed depending on body condition desired and activity level of the horse. A good quality hay or pasture should be fed in addition to the above concentrate. Forage should comprise at least 60% of the daily diet. Plenty of clean, fresh water should be provided at all times.
Ingredients:
Wheat middlings, wheat flour, ground corn, ground soybean hulls, rice bran, molasses, ground rice hulls, dehydrated alfalfa meal, corn distillers dried grains, calcium carbonate, calcium lignin sulfonate, dried beet pulp, salt, flaxseed, calcium propionate, saccharomyces cerevisiae, L-lysine, choline chloride, DL-alpha tocopheryl aceate, beta carotene, biotin, cyanocobalamin, D-alphatocopheryl acetate, riboflavin, calcium pantothenate, manganous oxide, zinc oxide, nicotinic acid, DL-methionine, vitamin A acetate, copper sulfate, calcium iodate, magnesium oxide, ferrous sulfate, manganese methionine complex, copper lysine complex, mineral oil, cholecalciferol, cobalt glucoheptonate, zinc methionine complex, brewers dried yeast, selenium yeast, sodium selenite
ACTIVITY
PLEASURE
per 100 lbs of body weight
Adult maintenance
Light work 0.25 to 0.50 lb
Moderate to hard work 0.5 to 1.0 lb
Early to mid-gestation 0.5 to 0.75 lb

Guaranteed Analysis from label:
Crude protein (min.)12.0%
Crude fat (min.)4.00%
Crude fiber (max.)13.5%
Calcium (Ca) (min.)0.75%
Calcium (Ca) (max.)1.25%
Phosphorus (P) (min.)0.50%
Salt (NaCl) (min.)0.40%
Salt (NaCl) (max.)0.90%
Copper (Cu) (min.)60 ppm
Selenium (Se)(min.)0.60 ppm
Zinc (Zn) (min.) 110 ppm
Vitamin A (min.)3,500 IU/lb.
Vitamin D-3 (min.)600 IU/lb.
Vitamin E (min.)50 IU/lb.


You'd be looking at feeding an average of 2 1/2 lbs, at the low end for maintenance, and 5 to 7 1/2 lbs for a broodmare at 1000 lb weight.

I've never seen a RB go over 2 1/2 lbs at maximum feeding levels.

I would consider this just a more concentrated feed.

[Mandzanita]

Peggy...TC was the one I REALLY wanted but there wasn't a dealer reasonably close to me :( I ended up buying the Enrich32 today to try it out. Man that stuff is not cheap! Here's another question. I don't feed a mixed hay, I actually feed the two in sepeperate feedings (Alf in the AM and Grass in the PM) I usually give the grain/supplements in the am with the alf flake. Will it be too much protein in one meal if I feed the Enrich32 with the alf flake in the morning or should I start feeding it at night with the grass flake? OR should I switch to feeding the grass and supplements in the am and the alf at night?

[Gypsy Rose]

Any reason why you can't split up the RB feedings?

[Mandzanita]

I guess I could, if that would be better for him.

[Gypsy Rose]

It would probably be better- horses do well on meals spaced throughout the day, and you'd want to introduce the feed change gradually anyway.

[Mandzanita]

Ok, I'll start doing that. Is 1 lb. split into two feedings of a 1/2 lb. of the RB ok for a 1200 horse or do I need more? I introuced the RB in this morning's feeding and I think I added about 1/2 cup to his normal ration of Strategy (what he's been on for a year now) I want to eventually work him off of the Strategy all together and end up with just the RB, BOSS and forage.

[Peggy Sue]

The amount of PROTIEN is really not a worry at all... the alfalfa you have is not as RICH as the east coast alfalfa ....

around 3 cups is 1lb so what you are doing is fine... just keep a close eye on his weight and TAKE pictures!! I can not stress this enough ... I had one drop weight on me last year and I caught it BEFORE it was a problem because I take a TON of pictures all the time... also weight tape him and keep an eye on his weight ... once he is completely on the RB I would tape about everyother week... so you catch any weight loss or gain before it is out of control

[Peggy Sue]

I think Enrich is 1 1/2 lb min and about 3lb max since I have yet to SEE the feeding directions I am going off of hearsay on that

[Gypsy Rose]

Feeding Recommendations:
Enrich™ 32 Supplement is designed to complement and fortify moderate/good-quality forages. These types of forages are usually grass or mature legumes and may vary in protein content anywhere from 5-17%. The feeding recommendations are based on the following assumptions: an expected mature weight of approximately 1,100 poundsa, the horse is consuming at least 2.0%b of its body weight in a moderate/good-quality hay or pasture (dry matter).

a For horses that do not approximate this expected mature weight (such as miniature horses, ponies and draft horses), feeding rates for mature horses at maintenance can be estimated based on providing approximately 1/4 pound of Enrich™ 32 Supplement with every 5 pounds of hay fed.

b Always provide a minimum of 1% of the horse’s body weight in hay or the equivalent in pasture (approx. 30 lbs. of growing pasture would be required to equal 10 lbs. of hay on a dry matter basis).

Growthc
Age
(months)Weight
(lbs)Enrich™ 32
(lbs/day)Hay
(lbs/day)4 - 8400 - 7002.5 - 3.08 - 149 - 17700 - 9002.0 - 2.514 - 1818 - 24900 - 10002.018 - 20
c More rapid rates of growth can be achieved by adding grain to the diet. However, given the inherent nutritional inconsistencies of straight grain diets, more rapid rates of gain are more safely and successfully achieved by using one of the completely fortified and balanced concentrates by Purina Mills. Contact your local Purina Mills product dealers for the feed that best suits your needs. The nutritional needs of foals less than four months of age are better satisfied with products such as Strategy® or Omolene #300®.

Maintenance and Reproductiond (based on 1100 pound mature)
Lifestyle Enrich™ 32
(lbs/day) Hay
(lbs/day) Horses at maintenance and broodmares through the 2nd trimester of gestation 1.0 - 2.0 22
d The additional calories needed during the last trimester of gestation and during lactation can be provided by adding grain to the diet. However, given the inherent nutritional inconsistencies of straight grain diets, a more nutritionally balanced and desirable source of calories can be provided by using one of the completely fortified and balanced concentrates by Purina Mills. Contact your local Purina Mills product dealers for the feed that best suits your needs.

Moderate Performancee
Lifestyle Enrich™ 32
(lbs/day) Hay
(lbs/day) Horses performing occasional work or recreational activities 1.5 - 2.5 22
e The additional calorie and nutrient demands of such horses are better satisfied with products such as Strategy®, Omolene #100® or # 200®, or Race Ready® horse feeds.

Guaranteed Analysis Crude Protein (Min) 32.0% Lysine (Min) 2.70% Crude Fat (Min) 5.00% Crude Fiber (Max) 5.50% Calcium (Min) 2.85% Calcium (Max) 3.85% Phosphorus (Min) 1.60% Salt (Min) 0.50% Salt (Max) 1.00% Magnesium (Min) 1.00% Potassium (Min) 1.50% Sulfur (Min) 0.35% Manganese (Min) 550.00 PPM Copper (Min) 185.00 PPM Cobalt (Min) 2.50 PPM Iodine (Min) 4.00 PPM Selenium (Min) 1.50 PPM Selenium (Max) 2.00 PPM Zinc (Min) 500.00 PPM Iron (Min) 600.00 PPM Vitamin A (Min) 24,000.00 IU/lb Vitamin D3 (Min) 2,500.00 IU/lb Vitamin E (Min) 500.00 IU/lb Thiamine (Min) 30.00 mg/lb Vitamin C (Min) 50.00 mg/lb Ruminant Meat And Bone Meal Free Ingredients:
Plant Protein Products, Processed Grain By-Products, Calcium Carbonate, Monocalcium Phosphate, Dicalcium Phosphate, Molasses Products, Forage Products, Soybean Oil, Salt, Thiamine, Magnesium Oxide, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Vitamin E Supplement, L-Lysine, Calcium Lignin Sulfonate, Copper Sulfate, Calcium Pantothenate, Zinc Oxide, Riboflavin Supplement, Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Supplement, Cobalt Carbonate, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Manganous Oxide, Calcium Iodate, Ferrous Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Ethylenediamine Dihydriodide, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Chloride, Sodium Selenite.

There you go, complete with guaranteed analysis and ingredients list, lol!

[Peggy Sue]

where did you get that dang thing?? she is mailing it to me so I will have one ON HAND to scan!!

[cyb]

Manzanita how much is the Enrich 32? I was looking for some today but my feed store went out of business (they sell Purina) so I ended up getting Safechoice by Nutrena at a different feed store (I know not a RB) . I was thinking of buying Triple Crown but the feed store had to order it as they said it didn't have a very long shelf life so they didn't keep it in stock unless someone requests it, they said the Triple Crown RB was about $25 for a 50 pound bag, does that sound about right? Another question should I buy the 12% or the 30% protein ? I have a 17 year old and a 4 year old, neither one is really active.

[Peggy Sue]

Cyb are you on grass or alfalfa?? if Grass you want the 30% if alfalfa the 12% ... the shelf life is about 90 to 120 days ... what I do is have the store keep the amount I use per month on hand... IOW the feed stores build too number is one bag above what I use... I shoudl say we since I order for four people

[Gypsy Rose]

where did you get that dang thing?? she is mailing it to me so I will have one ON HAND to scan!!


Off their website!:D

[Peggy Sue]

MY Ration Balancer runs $23 per bag so $25 is about right

[Peggy Sue]

Off their website!:D

LMAO just goes to show how long it has been since I checked their feeds on their site..:cowboy:

[Gypsy Rose]

:hysterical:Sorry- couldn't help it, lol!

Seriously, though, the label states by products, which means the ingredients could vary from region to region or batch to batch. Good luck to anyone trying to find out exactly what by products are used.

Bummer so few companies have fixed formula feeds.

[cyb]

Cyb are you on grass or alfalfa?? if Grass you want the 30% if alfalfa the 12% ...
They are on grass, if I buy the RB I know they only get about 1 pound per horse per day, should I be feeding grain in addition to the RB?

[Mandzanita]

Man I got ripped, I got one bag at $28! Then I found that the feed store that normally delivers my hay sells it for $24 so that's obviously where I'll get it from now on.

[Gypsy Rose]

If your horses aren't being worked hard, and maintain their weight fairly easily, the RB and good quality hay should be enough.

Grains are added to a RB only if the extra calories are needed.

[Gypsy Rose]

Forgot to mention- fortified feeds shouldn't be fed with a RB- usually oats are fed, lol!

[Peggy Sue]

and most horses do fine on 1lb a day UNLESS they are growing or old .....

[HogWild]

Peggy, I feed Enrich32 and best I remember, the range is 1lb - 2lb per day. At 32% protein, you probably do not want to overfeed.

[Peggy Sue]

Peggy, I feed Enrich32 and best I remember, the range is 1lb - 2lb per day. At 32% protein, you probably do not want to overfeed.


excess protien is not a worry , now the othervitamins/minerals can be a worry

it is a myth that too much protien will cause problems...that myth steams from the fact taht higher protien sweet feeds caused a horse to be hyper causing people to think the higher protien was higher energy we now know that it was the sugars and starches of traditianal feeds that caused the problem

[Mandzanita]

BOSS is fine to add with the RB for extra calories right? He could use a few more pounds, especially with winter on it's way. Oh and Peggy, someone tossed my Enrich32 bag so I'll be sending you the tag off the one I get tomarrow. :)

[Diane of Buck's Hollow]

I have taken Peggy Sue's advice and am now feeding our 2 horses...(Mira is too fat, and we are worried about founder) (Buck is now gaining weight fast)...

TC 30% with pasture grass and hay at night when we bring them in. We split the 1lb TC 30% into two feedings AM and PM each horse.

Does this sound right? anyone?

[Gypsy Rose]

Sounds right to me- but PeggySue's the RB expert, lol!

[Peggy Sue]

Diana I am glad to hear things are working out for you....

what your doing sounds GREAT.... has Mira lost any weight yet or too soon to tell??

You can add Beet pulp, alfalfa pellets/cubes or BOSS or Rice Bran for added calories or oats if you keep the levels LOW

[Tens Legacy]

What a great topic for a thread Peggy. I'm very interested to see how the ration balancers are working for other people's horses and to learn more about them. I started my quarter horse, Dude, on the one from Kalmbach feeds called Essential "K" about a year ago and was having such good results that I put my national show horse, Forest, on it also. I've been feeding Forest the same amount as Dude and am simply amazed how he has been holding his weight. I used to feed him 4 pds a day but on the rb he is only getting one pd. Now that winter is coming I just added a pd of regular feed to his diet for the calories.

[Diane of Buck's Hollow]

Diana I am glad to hear things are working out for you....

what your doing sounds GREAT.... has Mira lost any weight yet or too soon to tell??

You can add Beet pulp, alfalfa pellets/cubes or BOSS or Rice Bran for added calories or oats if you keep the levels LOW

We measured just a couple of days ago. We will start taking lots of pics..like the suggestion in an ealier post. We can't really tell yet. I am just feeling sooo much better about the whole situation now..knowing we are feeding the right way and taking care of her...and not worrying everyday about founder!!!

Thanks so much for your help Peggy Sue..

Maybe on some really cold mornings, I will give some hot bran..mmmmmmm!:)

[Gypsy Rose]

Tens Legacy, you really shouldn't feed regular feed with a RB. See PeggySue's post above you for suggestions on adding extra calories.

[Peggy Sue]

TL I wouldn't be feeding a "regulat FORTIFIED feed" witha ration balancer... I would add Beet PUlp, Alfalfa pellets/cubes or BOSS or Oats ... it is not recommened because it won't take much to push some vitamin/mineral levels into the toxic zone

[lovesfortune]

Very informative thread! I might have to come talk to you guys about my two in the spring if they are still a little tubby after winter. Right now they are just on pasture. Nothing else. But they didn't get worked a lot this summer.

[Peggy Sue]

lovesfortune I wouldn't wait until Spring start them with what they need now if possible... I have NEVER in my years YEARS man I am getting old had feeding as easy as I do now... AND in the spring when I pull mine in to ride again I don't have to worry about the spring bounces like I use tooo ... Sassy sat for almost a year due to some hoof issues and when I got back on her besides being UNABLE to perform some stuff because she was out of shape it was like she hadn't missed a thing... my 3yo went to trainers for 30 days for my son and he never took a wrong step no buck and remembered everything I had taught him and retained everything he was taught!!!!

[lovesfortune]

Okay so what do you recommend for two overweight Appaloosa trail horses? :) Our gelding is 17. Our mare is 13. We do very very light trail riding. And we feed free choice grass hay with a little bit of alfalfa mixed in with it, but hardly enough to even mention in the winter. Summer they are 100% on pasture.

[Peggy Sue]

do a search and see what brands you can get then ask me that question or PM me your zip and I can help that way but bear with me... this new puter is driving me NUTS!! and I can't figure out how to get my spell checker back either !!!!!!

[Remali]

This is a great thread.....I've learned so much from you guys!!

[Tens Legacy]

I talked to the nutritionist, from Kalmbach feeds, who developed this line of feed. He specifically recommended that I feed the regular feed called Kalm ‘N EZ with the rb (Essential "K"), to add calories, he stated that they were developed to work together so I wouldn’t have any problems. Also I do not feed very much of either feed one Pd of the rb with one pd of the reg. feed for winter. I would hope that since he developed these that he is correct in what he is telling me. I surly do not want to harm my horses.

[Gypsy Rose]

I talked to the nutritionist, from Kalmbach feeds, who developed this line of feed. He specifically recommended that I feed the regular feed called Kalm ‘N EZ with the rb (Essential "K"), to add calories, he stated that they were developed to work together so I wouldn’t have any problems. Also I do not feed very much of either feed one Pd of the rb with one pd of the reg. feed for winter. I would hope that since he developed these that he is correct in what he is telling me. I surly do not want to harm my horses.

Do you have the feed labels for these products, and could you scan them? I can't find either product on their site.

[Peggy Sue]

TL at those levels you are perfectly safe and if it was a nutritist from there they KNOW their products and most of them are pretty good

The ONLY company I have had tell me was wild stuff was Purina LOL

[Tens Legacy]

Peggy thank you for putting my mind at ease about what I am using.

Gypsy Rose here is the website for Kalmback feeds it is a little difficult to navigate so I put the link directly to the feeds that I am using. Actally it shows all of the the essential "K" line of feed in more detail.

http://www.tributehorsefeeds.com/kalm-%27n-ez-pelleted.html


I do have one other question. The rb that I'm using is pelleted (only form it comes in). I chose to use the Kalm N EZ pelleted form but they also have a textured form which would be better to use or does it matter? I didn't realize when I talked to the nutritonist that there was a choice. I realized it at the store and had to make a split second decision.

[Peggy Sue]

NOramlly the pellets are low nsc because of the pelleting process but it wont' be enough to matter I haven't looked at thier complete line I tend to study the RB's LOL does that surprise anybody I will take a look later my son wants to ride now so I am off to watch and play coach

[Gypsy Rose]

Thanks, TL! The RB actually looks pretty good- just at a glance, anyway- that's more PeggySue's area- analizing the nutrients. The only thing I'm not happy with is the low vitamin E level in the RB- if that's all someone was feeding besides hay or other forage, I'd add extra E to it.

[Peggy Sue]

Healthy adult horses, with no stress from disease, injury, infection or exercise, not reproductively active: bare minimum 800 to 1000 IU/day vitamin E.
• Healthy horses in regular exercise: 1800 to 3000 IU/day.
• Correction of vitamin E deficiency, or supplementation during diseases where higher requirements are likely—such as chronic infections, nervous system diseases, muscular disorders, chronic lung disease like heaves—3000 to 5000 IU/day.

[Peggy Sue]

They are providing HALF of the NRC recommended level ... also
http://www.myhorse.com/health/supplements/safe_vitamin_e_and_selenium_intakes.aspx#top

Adding vitamin E to packaged feeds or multi-ingredient vitamin/mineral mixes is routinely done at low levels. Higher supplementation probably wouldn’t help much anyway because E is fragile, and its activity is readily destroyed by exposure to low-level bacterial or fungal activity, air, sunlight and the presence of free minerals. The solution is to meet the horse’s requirements by a separate supplement.

[Gypsy Rose]

Thanks PeggySue- that's exactly what I meant!:)Only you provided exact amounts- cool!

[Peggy Sue]

yeah yeah I know I need to make a spreadsheet with ALL the RB's on it and maybe somebody can help me post it somewhere