Pessoa vs. older Stubben

[Annasmom]

Ok so I'm on the hunt for the perfect saddle. Right now we ride in a wintec 500 18" seat and a wide gullet and it works ok but its not the best fit for either of us and its not the best quality either.

I haven't been looking very avidly quite yet but I happen to come upon (on another forum) a Stubben Siegfried. Its the right tree size (in Stubben) for her and an 18" seat. Its in PERFECT condition even though its probably 8+ years old it doesn't look anything close to that.

Anyway the pessoa's always looked softer and more comfy and appealing to the eye but I have seen some that are only 3 years old and have consierable amounts of bad leather damage. My question is they are asking $600 o.b.o for this saddle should I go for it or wait.

[cloedoll]

Pessoa's aren't bad saddles, but they aren't what they used to be. If you can find one of the original Pessoa's, grab it in a hear beat, but the newer ones just don't have the same quality they used to. Stubben's (again, older ones, the quality of them have gone down over the years, too) are amazing saddles, that would be my first choice over a newer Pessoa.

[Annasmom]

Thanks for the input caitlin thats what I keep hearing haha :) seems like its true. I have seen a handful of pessoas that are just cracked and worn and under 5 yrs old that would be a dissapointment. Have you sat in a stubben? What about a bates caprilli.. or I guess what i'm asking out of all the 'popular" brands what a good one that you can get for $800 or lower used thats a good saddle for local shows and training for now.

[MileHighOlli]

I have to agree with caitlin. I have a stubben sigfried that is at least a decade old and looks like new. When I bought it I did have it sent in to have the knee rolls re-done but other then that it has been a dream.

I do not have any expirence with the pessoas but good to know that they have maintance issues for future refrence.

[Annasmom]

Milehigh- Thats good to know that someone else has an older one that is still in great shape I mean this one looks brand new except the knee rolls do look a bit used but its just gorgeous it just looks hard lol. The seat. I don't know I probably will end up buying it :) and reselling if it doesn't work out.

[cloedoll]

Crosby Centennial, or any Crosby, Stubbens (older ones), Beval (you could find deals under $800), old Pessoa's, Harby Dabbs (I have definitely seen some nice ones under $800), Courbette's, County's (again, I have seen some serious deals, ha ha), HDR Advantage line - I'm still thinking, lol! I also do like Bates saddles. :)

[Annasmom]

Thanks Caitlin ahha :) I wish I could try some but everyone at my barn has stubbens. And I don't want to fork over $2000 to try a bates I probably won't even buy ya know.

I'll keep hunting!

let me know if you find any deals while browsing I need a 32cm/wide tree and a 17", 17.5" or possibly 18" seat.

[cloedoll]

No problem! If you would like, I could post some sites were you can take the saddles on trial to see if you like them or not. :)

[Annasmom]

yeah! that would be very helpful part of my problem which is a personal thing is I don't want to sell my circle Y. :/ its pratically new and new its $1800. So I'm sure I could sell it for $1000 or $950 I never ride western anymore but I always thing but what if I do someday? Its the most perfect saddle its amazing and it fits us both but maybe I need to part with it?

[cloedoll]

Usedsaddles.com
VTOSaddlery.com

There are more, lemme go find 'em. :D

[Annasmom]

Thanks cloe!! :D that is so helpful I have to go do my pre-cal homework but i'll be back on here in 30 minutes or so.

[cloedoll]

Alrighty, have fun with homework. :D

[mlle_beau]

I was going to buy a Stubben that was older than me and still looked beautiful but unfortunately the seat was too small for me. It was a great example of how well they hold out though, the leather looked almost new! I did find with it that the seat size tends to run small but if the one you're looking at is an 18" I'm sure it would be fine. I've never ridden in a Pessoa saddle so I can't attest to them but Crosby is a really good brand also and you can find good conditon Crosby saddles for under $800.

[mlle_beau]

Here is the list I've compiled over time of commonly recommended saddle brands in case the Stubben doesn't work out for you. Most of these would probably be available used for $800 or less:
Collegiate, Courbette, Passier, Stubben, Thornhill County, Crosby, Kieffer, Duett, Thorowgood, Maxam, pessoa, ainsley, Beval, Antares, Schleese

[cloedoll]

I would drop dead if I came across a Antares or Schleese under $800! Ha ha!

[mlle_beau]

Lol that's why I said most, not all!

[cloedoll]

Lol that's why I said most, not all!

Oo, whoopsie! :o

[Blue]

I've also heard that the older Stubbens and Pessoas are better. I really want an old Stubben! I just bought a new saddle though...so not right now! lol.

[Happy Horselover]

The comfiest saddle I ever sat in was a 10+ year old Stubben Siegfried. I own a Stubben Roxane and I love it. I would always go for the Stubben!

[rather-b-riding]

I hae owned quite a few Stubben's, Passier's , Crosby's, and a Courbette(I was an Ebay saddle junkie for a while and was just buying saddles left and right :D) I have since sold most of the ones I bought but here is what I found..

Quality of the Stubben's was wonderful. Leather was usually in excellent shape. There was the occasional cracking but that was probably more due to neglect by the previous owner. I did find the seat's rather hard on the older model's.

Passier- again, great quality. Same with the Crosby's. Out of all of them the Crosby's leather quality did seem to hold up just a slight bit better over the other brands.
JMHO;)

[EnglishGuy]

Tobeys' owner has a Stubben. It is awesome, I use it instead of my own. Its an older one, but the quality is amazing.

[cloedoll]

I found some saddles on eBay!

17" W Crosby XL (http://cgi.ebay.com/17-W-Crosby-XL-Excel-Saddle_W0QQitemZ160289464528QQcmdZViewItem?hash=it em160289464528&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C 240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
18/33 Prestige Nona Garson (http://cgi.ebay.com/18-18-33-Prestige-Nona-Garson-Saddle_W0QQitemZ290265934083QQcmdZViewItem?hash=it em290265934083&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C 240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
Crosby Equilibrium 17 1/2" (http://cgi.ebay.com/Crosby-Equilibrium-saddle-Never-used-LOOK_W0QQitemZ250304618018QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item 250304618018&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C 240%3A1308&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
18" Bates Elevation H (http://cgi.ebay.com/Used-18-Bates-Elevation-H-Jumping-Saddle_W0QQitemZ260296541954QQcmdZViewItem?hash=it em260296541954&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C 240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)

[shynbvs]

what catlin said, lol. I would definitely go for an older stubben, my friend has an older one and i love it.

[barngal]

I don't think you can go wrong on an older Stubben. I do think you can find a nice one for under $800. though. I went saddle hunting several months ago and found a few Crosbys that were real nice. I tried out a Crosby Centennial and it was very cushy (too much for me) but the price was $900. I found many afterward on Ebay for $500-$600. I did end up with an older Crosby Equilibrium (Tad Coffin style). Nothing but knee blocks but really nice for $400. and is comfy enough for trail riding. As long as you are careful and do your homework, you can find some awesome deals on Ebay.

[Palogal]

The new Pessoas are not as nice as the older ones are not the same quality they used to be. I'd go with the Stubben, the older ones especially are great.

[Annasmom]

Thanks guys for all the replies I've been too busy to do anything lately! Man o man.. :)
So I'm hearing it more for the Stubbens
I have done some research this week
and I have found that I do not want a bates caprilli.. they look nice but I hate the changeable gullets thats what I have now and the MW gullet pinches her , so I changed it to wide and now I can't even ride because the saddle slips every which way no matter how tight it is. :nono: So frusterating!

anyways right now I have too options both will allow a return which is an excellent thing.
I found a new stubben seigfried for $1000 comes with leathers and all this, and the other is a 10 year old one that is $600 o.b.o but isn't being sold easily so I think I could make an offer that comes with everything+ a bridle. so I'm wondering if I can negotiate it and borrow the money from my parents to buy the older one that will at least give me something to ride it that actually fits her until I save up $1200 plus for "the one" haha

thanks for all the advice keep posting
esp. if anyone see's any that might work on ebay!

[cloedoll]

Do you have pictures of the saddles?

[Annasmom]

I do I made an offer of $300 on the older stubben so we will see if that happens.

I have to dig up the pictures of the new one. The only thing with it is I've never tried a stubben siegfried so I don't know if I want to spend that much for a temporary. The saddle I'm getting now just needs to fit both of us until I can save enough for a nicer one.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j222/Savvy_cowgurl/oldstub.jpg

[rums_mom]

That is a great deal for that saddle. My daughter's trainer has a Stubben Siegfried and she loves it, so much so that she is looking for another one.

I guess you are looking for a AP? My daughter is thinking of selling her Stubben Roxane Dressage saddle and her Kiefer Dressage saddle. So if you want a dressage saddle, let me know.

[Annasmom]

O definintly I'd be intersted! In any Stubben right now I'm still doing basics until summer so I could ride any AP dressage/CC whatever it doesn't matter. Let me ask your opnion on this would you rather pay $300 for the above saddle , or wait to gather up $1000 for a brand new one?

[cloedoll]

O definintly I'd be intersted! In any Stubben right now I'm still doing basics until summer so I could ride any AP dressage/CC whatever it doesn't matter. Let me ask your opnion on this would you rather pay $300 for the above saddle , or wait to gather up $1000 for a brand new one?

Overall, for $300, I think it would be a steal. The seat looks a little hard, but you could always buy a seat saver.

[Annasmom]

well I don't think she is going to accept my $300 offer good news though I found a brand new one same size and everything comes with girth stirrups and leathers. Its only been put on a horse and she is offering a return for $900.

And if perfect timing ever did exist someone is coming to check out my circle y for sale on saturday

thank you guys for your help! I'll keep everyone updation

[Annasmom]

ok so I found a brand new seigfreid the size and tree I need for $900 which I'll try to make an offer of $850 it comes with stubben leathers and girth so thats pretty good it's only been put on her horse never used. The thing is I love how Anna looks in black ahha but i want to start hunter/jumper before going back to dressage so I guess I should worry about a h/j saddle for now here is a picture of it any opnions would be great.

when I made an offer on the other saddle they said its pretty much $600 firm and I didn't want to go that high.. since its so old and I could get a new one for around $800.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j222/Savvy_cowgurl/stubben2.jpg

also any opnions on this color for anna
I'm ordering a pink mattes pad. :)

[Annasmom]

any opnions!!!?!? :) im interested

[cloedoll]

This *probably* isn't what you want to hear, but that is a newer Stubben and newer Stubbens quality just don't compare to older Stubbens. I am sure it is still a great saddle, but not as nice as older ones. =/

[Annasmom]

haha I would agree actually. :) what do you think of it as a saddle overall

[cloedoll]

Overall, I think it's a good saddle for a good price. (:

[Annasmom]

thanks caitlin well this lady will not email me back so.. ? I'm not sure what to do.

I cant seem to find another used
anyone let me know if you see one pop up :)

[cloedoll]

Heh, I'll be on the lookout for you!

[cloedoll]

What about this one?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Stubben-Jumping-Saddle-17-5_W0QQitemZ280279766575QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item280 279766575&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1418|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A13 18 (http://cgi.ebay.com/Stubben-Jumping-Saddle-17-5_W0QQitemZ280279766575QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item280 279766575&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1418%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C 240%3A1318)

[Annasmom]

ITS PERFECT! I'm going to talk to my parents right now haha :)

[cloedoll]

Hehe, I hope they let you get it!

[luvs2ride1979]

I know I'm late, but I wanted to confirm that the older Stubbens are better than the newer ones. I would not hesitate to pay $600 for an older but in good condition Stubben! If you can find a Wotan, they are awesome... Siegfrieds are great too. I have two now! lol One is my Husband's and the other is my daughter's "new" saddle. It needs reflocking an some stitching re-don, but it was only $200 (partial trade, so only $125 out of pocket) and in very good shape otherwise. It's usable as-is, just not all that pretty, lol. It's an 80s model. My husband's is a late 70s saddle and is in GREAT shape! We had it restuffed and there are some surface cracks underneath, but from the top it looks pretty darn good.

[luvs2ride1979]

Also, forgot to mention, if you can find an older Passier, BUY IT! They are GREAT saddles and wear like iron. They do come up on eBay and used tack sites occasionally.

[Annasmom]

luvs what do you think of that ebay one. my parents are coming up with a "decision" tommorow its an eidleweiss it looks in great condition and for $600 I could easily get another saddle with my budget maybe a dressage like i've wanted so i wouldn't have to borrow my trainers dressage

[luvs2ride1979]

It definitely looks like a nice saddle. It's newer, but if you can get it for under $700, I would definitely snag it. If it ends up going higher, then I'd look at an older Stubben.

[shynbvs]

Pessoa's aren't bad saddles, but they aren't what they used to be. If you can find one of the original Pessoa's, grab it in a hear beat, but the newer ones just don't have the same quality they used to. Stubben's (again, older ones, the quality of them have gone down over the years, too) are amazing saddles, that would be my first choice over a newer Pessoa.

This is what i've heard. Unfortunately this has happened to so many things know. I would go w/ the stuben but im not en expert;)