It's funny..

[Kaitlyn]

How opposites just happen in the workplace.

I drive a Ford, and have a piss on Obama sticker on my back windshield..and I'm Caucasian.

New driver at work drives a Toyota (Corolla no less), and has an Obama '08 sticker on his car and is Asian.

No wonder we don't talk. lol.

[Tatesgram]

:hysterical::hysterical: Thanks Kaitlyn, that made me laugh.

[Kaitlyn]

Three things:

1) Disclaimer sorta, that race isn't an issue, it's just funny how the stereotype worked.

2) Sorry WB's, oopsie moment on where I put this thread and..

3) Glad I could make ya laugh Tatesgram :)

[WashingtonBay]

Well, it may be the reason you're not on his Christmas list...

[miatapony]

LOL love it ....

[JackieB]

Just one comment. Don't laugh at this and then turn around bemoan the demise of common courtesy, decency, respect for one another, etc., the way we do on this forum sometimes.

By the way, my thoughts on this have nothing to do with the President. I didn't even know there was such a sticker. I've always hated those things even if it's just the ones that say Ford or Chevy. In humor, they depict an extremely vulgar act and somewhere along the line we decided that it's OK to publicly display these things and laugh at them.

Call me a prude or whatever, but I really don't like those things.

ETA: If anyone asks me to, I'll delete this post. I can see that people are having fun laughing at it, and I like Kaitlyn just fine. I don't want to be the one where someone says "Well, we were having fun until sissy-man JackieB came along and ruined it all. :)"

[HoustonFarrier]

Jackie....ya gotta unwind man...yer gonna have a heart-attack soon !!! Lighten up, it's ok to laugh, even when it's not PC to do so :):p One can still be polite and courteous and still tell blonde jokes (or in my case...pollack jokes) :D

Steve

[Tatesgram]

Jackie, as I tell my husband, don't be so literal. It made me laugh because of the differences in people. I can relate, I work with a few folks that I find it a strain to get along with. But with the good Lords help, I manage.

It was just an observation. :)

[JackieB]

Jackie....ya gotta unwind man...yer gonna have a heart-attack soon !!! Lighten up, it's ok to laugh, even when it's not PC to do so :):p One can still be polite and courteous and still tell blonde jokes (or in my case...pollack jokes) :D

Steve

Thanks for thinking of me. Actually, I don't stress about these things, so that's good.

And I agree with you on the jokes. My mom was 100% Polish and nobody liked a Polish joke more than her. I picked that up from her and am also the first to agree that we have gotten to be way too PC.

There's just something about those window stickers (all of them, I'm not concerned with the object of the insult). To me, they go beyond humor. But, that's a wonderful thing about living in the US - The First Amendment protects such expression and there is absolutely no way I would change it.

[WashingtonBay]

FWIW, Jackie, I'm something of a prude as well, at least in public, so I agree on vulgar bumper stickers. They aren't my style, I don't like to see them. Whenever I see something like that in public, on a bumper sticker, or a hat or shirt for that matter, I always have this fear that my sweet grandmother would see something like that, even though she's long gone now. There is just some kinds of innocence that should be protected, not by censorship, but by good manners.

On this one... are we just talking about the little boy peeing sticker, that can be put over anything?

[JackieB]

Jackie, as I tell my husband, don't be so literal.

Maybe I do need to work on that a bit. But, in fairness, the stickers are 100% literal in their depiction.

Anyway, I apologize if I ruined your thread here, Kaitlyn. I probably should have just kept this thought to myself. I was getting ready to delete my post, but then I realized that the responses wouldn't make sense.

So, carry on and Rock On!

[Arrow]

I suppose just Toyota/Obama sticker and Ford/piss on Obama sticker wouldn't have been funny--it's adding a third thing, pointing out that you two are of different races, that makes it funny.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha, funniest thing I've heard all day.

Perhaps this will set us on the way to a color-blind society: Republican--white Ford owner, Democrat--Asian Toyota owner.

Ha ha ha ha ha...

Was there a drunken hispanic guy laughing the next row over?

[WashingtonBay]

I'm not sure color blind is really the right goal, unless the goal is to cease to be different, and evolve into this sortof generic uni-race. Do you think the man should be embarrassed that he's Asian? Seriously! Is it ~insulting~ in any way that a caucasian drives a truck? Why would it be embarrassing or insulting for one of the players here to be Asian? Race is not a social disease, it's a description. ;)

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

[...]
Was there a drunken hispanic guy laughing the next row over?

No... he was Irish. :)

[HoustonFarrier]

No... he was Irish. :)

rut-ro...yer gonna get a lecture now :p LOL

Steve

[Arrow]

Race is not a social disease, it's a description. ;)

Just a description, eh?

Here are two threads with "Hispanic" in the title--both threads are about negative encounters with men. These are the only two threads with Hispanic in the title.

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/search.php?searchid=291657

White in only one thread title as a description of a person, with a joke that insults Indians:

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2704&highlight=white

Black in one thread title as a description of a person, this joke seems o.k., although WB posted that it was "arguably inappropriate."

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3359&highlight=black

Recent thread with no racial description at all (Have you heard of this guy?):
http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9343

Threads about annoying friends, lazy husbands, good husbands, wonderful trainers, cruddy jockeys, etc. ad infinitum with no racial descriptions in the titles--too many to count, didn't even bother to try (I did, actually--searched for "white" in the title, the only hit was the one mentioned above.


Race is just a description in the following cases: The black man walked over the bridge. The Asian man swam in the sea. The white woman rode her horse.

But if the thread is about negative encounters with people where no racial description is needed to identify the person, or if a thread is about Obama supporters vs. Obama detractors, then the use of race is more than a description--it's about saying that we are different, and I'm on the right side (someone accosted me, the person is a Democrat). Race is more than a simple description in those cases.

[HoustonFarrier]

Just a description, eh?

Here are two threads with "Hispanic" in the title--both threads are about negative encounters with men. These are the only two threads with Hispanic in the title.

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/search.php?searchid=291657

White in only one thread title as a description of a person, with a joke that insults Indians:

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2704&highlight=white

Black in one thread title as a description of a person, this joke seems o.k., although WB posted that it was "arguably inappropriate."

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3359&highlight=black

Recent thread with no racial description at all (Have you heard of this guy?):
http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9343

Threads about annoying friends, lazy husbands, good husbands, wonderful trainers, cruddy jockeys, etc. ad infinitum with no racial descriptions in the titles--too many to count, didn't even bother to try (I did, actually--searched for "white" in the title, the only hit was the one mentioned above.


Race is just a description in the following cases: The black man walked over the bridge. The Asian man swam in the sea. The white woman rode her horse.

But if the thread is about negative encounters with people where no racial description is needed to identify the person, or if a thread is about Obama supporters vs. Obama detractors, then the use of race is more than a description--it's about saying that we are different, and I'm on the right side (someone accosted me, the person is a Democrat). Race is more than a simple description in those cases.

Hmmmm...this thread was just about a humorous comparison........and now look. I remember a certain someone telling me something about being a "turd in the punch bowl" ??????? Who was it that told me that ????

:D

Steve

[WashingtonBay]

Just a description, eh?

Well it certainly IS a description. Whether there is some perceived insult in the description is what we get all anxious about these days, isn't it?


Here are two threads with "Hispanic" in the title--both threads are about negative encounters with men. These are the only two threads with Hispanic in the title.

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/search.php?searchid=291657Like it or not, the second story posted there is something that I've seen reported several times on several forums, always Hispanic buyers. It appears to be relevant to understanding this 'trend', as horse owners.



White in only one thread title as a description of a person, with a joke that insults Indians:

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2704&highlight=whiteActually, I think it insults white people, and modern "progress".


Black in one thread title as a description of a person, this joke seems o.k., although WB posted that it was "arguably inappropriate."

http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3359&highlight=blackI said it was inappropriate for language. But it can't exactly be edited out without losing it's punch line. And again... it appears the one who was [made to look like an ass] in the joke is not the black girl, but the 'stranger', whose race is not given.


Recent thread with no racial description at all (Have you heard of this guy?):
http://www.baywindfarm.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9343

Threads about annoying friends, lazy husbands, good husbands, wonderful trainers, cruddy jockeys, etc. ad infinitum with no racial descriptions in the titles--too many to count, didn't even bother to try (I did, actually--searched for "white" in the title, the only hit was the one mentioned above.


Race is just a description in the following cases: The black man walked over the bridge. The Asian man swam in the sea. The white woman rode her horse.

But if the thread is about negative encounters with people where no racial description is needed to identify the person, or if a thread is about Obama supporters vs. Obama detractors, then the use of race is more than a description--it's about saying that we are different, and I'm on the right side (someone accosted me, the person is a Democrat). Race is more than a simple description in those cases.Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. Sometimes knowing the race is relevant, sometimes it's not. Why should we be all wrapped up in knots worried about whether it's a positive or negative portrayal before using the description? That too, is racist, in the most overprotective, patronizing kind of way. In a sense, it's far more insulting to do that than it is to just insult them when deserved, just like everyone else, from rednecks to hillbillies to hippies.

[Arrow]

Well, sometimes examining and dissecting turds is the best way to diagnose illnesses.

[Tatesgram]

No... he was Irish. :)


Hey, I resemble that remark. For the record, I'm Irish and Indian (cherokee) and I love Irish or Indian jokes.

For the record Arrow, that joke is not insulting to Native Americans, it's insulting to WHITE people.

[Arrow]

Well, I consider this insulting to Indians--it perpetuates untrue stereotypes:

Women did all the work, Medicine man free. Indian man spend all day
hunting and fishing; all night having sex.

[cheval]

Three things:

1) Disclaimer sorta, that race isn't an issue, it's just funny how the stereotype worked.

2) Sorry WB's, oopsie moment on where I put this thread and..

3) Glad I could make ya laugh Tatesgram :)

I'm glad you said something (No. 1), because when I first read it though O.M.G., is she saying what I think she's saying? It sure didn't sound like you.

[HoustonFarrier]

Well, sometimes examining and dissecting turds is the best way to diagnose illnesses.

So...IOW...when YOU do it, it MUST be the right thing to do....but when someone ELSE does it..they MUST be wrong???? LMAO:p

Steve

[Arrow]

But of course, Steve! Finally, I've gotten through to you....:p

[HoustonFarrier]

But of course, Steve! Finally, I've gotten through to you....:p

See...you CAN teach an old dog new tricks :D

Steve

[cheval]

I hate those bumper stickers (the pee on whatever ones). There was a group of people that ran around with the names of one of our F&W Officers. Turned out they had been busted by the Officer for a very valid reason - poaching.

I think those stickers are really juvenile.

[WashingtonBay]

Well, I consider this insulting to Indians--it perpetuates untrue stereotypes:

Women did all the work, Medicine man free. Indian man spend all day
hunting and fishing; all night having sex.

What's untrue? Did Indian women not work pretty darn hard? Was there money exchanged with the medicine man? Did Indian men not hunt and fish? Did they not have sex?

Have we really been lied to all this time, by all those Native American stories in history exhibits and movies?

The point is, life was 'simpler' then. Is it oversimplified, yes... but the idea that 'hunting and fishing' - now just a pleasurable hobby, was once the "man of the house"s JOB, seems pretty idealic in it's portrayal.

[WashingtonBay]

Cheval... I think JB and I, and you, are the only ones who cared about the peeing part.

For whatever reason, the really insulting part is that he's Asian. Arrow, why, in this story, is it "negative" (your rule) that a democrat be Asian? I'm not even sure it's a common stereotype. But if it was, is it a bad thing to be associated with Obama or liberalism, and be Asian?

[Arrow]

It's a stereotype, the relationship between the genders in Indian society is more complicated than that, and it differs from tribe to tribe. When Europeans arrived and saw Indian woman farming--a job men did in European society--they began denigrating it right away. Steve joked about a lecture, and I don't think y'all really want one.

As for "hispanic horse buyers"--maybe that's true, and maybe it's a racist stereotype. Many white horse buyers do similar things, and when I was a kid in Pennsylvania, people said "don't sell a horse to the Amish, they work them to death."

As for the second "Hispanic man" thread--how do you justify that one as acceptable?

[cheval]

That's why I'm glad she made the disclaimer - because it really initially looked like a racist comment. I know now it was meant to be funny.

As far as the Indian comment - yes, that was their lifestyle but I think the general comment really makes light of Indians. I work with the tribes down here a lot. You'd be surprised (or maybe not) the crap they still get about 'teepee creeping', getting paid in alcohol and all the other stuff.

[cheval]

As for the second "Hispanic man" thread--how do you justify that one as acceptable?

Arrow is right, that was way unacceptable.

[Arrow]

Arrow, why, in this story, is it "negative" (your rule) that a democrat be Asian? I'm not even sure it's a common stereotype. But if it was, is it a bad thing to be associated with Obama or liberalism, and be Asian?

Why mention that he's Asian? What's the purpose? The only reason to use it as a description is to highlight the difference between the op and her coworker. I think that having a bumper stick about peeing on Obama means that the op thinks of Obama supporters in a negative light. What if it had been a white guy or a white woman? Would there have been a thread? Would the story have been told about two white women? No--no racial description would have been used.

[cheval]

That was my thought.

[WashingtonBay]

It's a stereotype, the relationship between the genders in Indian society is more complicated than that

Of course it's more complicated than that.... but either we can never pretend to make any group observations or know anything, or we can bog ourselves down unnecessarily with disclaimers every time we try to say anything.

I prefer to allow group stereotypes. They can be really helpful to understanding differences, as well as those atypical examples that defy the stereotype.

You've bought into this idea that stereotypes are a moral wrong, whether they are factually right or not. I don't think they are. They too are part of cultural identity. Take the good with the bad. I think most of us can joke about white people without thinking white people are less worthy as human beings.... they are, just like everyone else, full of their flaws and funny bits, both cultural, racial, and historical.


As for "hispanic horse buyers"--maybe that's true, and maybe it's a racist stereotype. Many white horse buyers do similar things, and when I was a kid in Pennsylvania, people said "don't sell a horse to the Amish, they work them to death."

Well, people still think that would be a valid worry about the Amish. They do tend to work them harder than most pets get worked. Is it relevant that a buyer is Amish? A trainer? A cabinet maker? For some, it's a feature.

As for the second "Hispanic man" thread--how do you justify that one as acceptable?

Are you talking about the drunken proposition now? Why do I have to justify it as acceptable? It is what it is... That she gave race painted more colorful imagery to her retelling of it. I was picturing a hispanic man with an accent in the words... a little different picture than if I was thinking the guy looked like a drunk Bill Gates. It didn't lead me to think ALL hispanic men must be perverts or anything.

[WashingtonBay]

Why mention that he's Asian? What's the purpose? The only reason to use it as a description is to highlight the difference between the op and her coworker. I think that having a bumper stick about peeing on Obama means that the op thinks of Obama supporters in a negative light. What if it had been a white guy or a white woman? Would there have been a thread? Would the story have been told about two white women? No--no racial description would have been used.

But since it was mentioned, who do you think suffers for it? Why can't race be as benign as mentioning that it was an Obama supporter or a Toyota?

I think the important difference is the Obama sticker part, not the Asian part, honestly... unless you're all bunched up about race. So yes, I do think the story of the two stickers would still have been told, even if both players were the same race.

[cheval]

I saw it as the Obama sticker but was really curious as to the "Asian" thing. At first I thought, holy crap, what was up with that. Then I thought well maybe it was just a description to further the story. But it could have easily just been my coworker - regardless of race. I dunno. The whole thing about saying Asian just made me wonder if there was something else going on. There may not have been.

[Kaitlyn]

I'm sorry Arrow you take offense.

JackieB, you're fine. You didn't ruin anything, it's with any post some agree, some don't, it's just weird my exact opposite works with me now. :)

[WashingtonBay]

I still wonder why it's bad to associate an Asian as being a democrat.

Not only am I not sure the stereotype would ring true if you worked it out, I'm not sure why the opposition to it is coming from democrats (Arrow). Why is it a shameful or negative portrayal of a race???

I think we're in this uncomfortable middle period, in dealing with race. So many people get twitchy about even bringing it up, which is the opposite of true acceptance and equality.

[cheval]

For me, I wasn't associating the Asian/Democrat thing at all. I was curious about the whole point of Asian being mentioned. I guess I just never refer people by their race. I work with all of them and that just struck me as, what does she mean by saying that. To me, they are that guy or that girl or that idiot.

[WashingtonBay]

Any of you guys seen the Goode Family? Check it out.... we think it's really funny.

Background:

YouTube - The Goode Family - New Midseason Series on ABC - Preview

Clips:

YouTube - The Goode Family...being good is hard these days.

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

[...]
I guess I just never refer people by their race. [...]

Well, to me race is merely a descriptor and carries no inherent judgement. It's a useful way to paint a thought picture when trying to communicate with somebody. If I'm trying to explain a story and describe all of the people, then there are many attributes to use. Sex, hair color, height, race, dress or any number of such things may all be useful in creating that thought picture. Leaving out attributes only serves to less fully communicate the event.

Race shouldn't be untouchable. It isn't leprosy. It shouldn't be treated that way.

[cheval]

I see your point, but with our past history, race has been a bigger issue. I think you can still communicate a story without it. I don't say, my white male friend and I went to lunch or my white female friend and I are going to the movies this weekend. You go with a person, that should be good enough. JMO.

[HoustonFarrier]

I see your point, but with our past history, race has been a bigger issue.

I think allot of (mostly white) folks are too sensitive to race issues, primarily because, as white people, we have been made to feel guilty/responsible for what happened in the early years of our country....WE ARE NOT.

Look..slavery is OVER...has been over for a long time. Civil rights are law...have been for a long time. But people like JJ, Al Sharpton, the Democrat party, and a slew of others have kept the slavery alive and forefront in our conscious. Are there still injustices...yep...against blacks, whites, indians, asians...you name it, it's there. Always will be there. We must, as a nation, continue to TEACH our young a better way, and strive to make the future better than the past. We must END the capability of people to make money and gain power through keeping the past racial injustices alive. Until that happens, it will never get better.

I have a long German heritage behind me.....am I sorry about the holocaust..yes...do I continue to DWELL on it...no. I did not participate in it....my father and mother did not participate in it, my grand-parents did not participate in it....and I should not have to pay a price for it. It is history. Learn from history...but STOP re-living history, and constantly bringing it back.

Eric Holder is right on one thing....we, as a nation, are afraid to discuss race....because when we do, we are called racists by the PC police.

Steve

[cheval]

With all the government sensitivity trainings we go through, that's probably what makes me neurotic about it. You say one thing that even remotely looks like a race issue and it's big trouble.

[WashingtonBay]

Neurotic is a good word for our current uneasiness about it. Everyone is trying so hard to be "goode", that they don't even realize how elitist and condescending that is. I think it's a phase... a pendulum swing one way then the other, eventually it will settle in the middle but in the mean time, no one has the right perspective on it, certainly not anyone who is called a "sensitivity trainer". Yes, I've been to them too.

[HoustonFarrier]

With all the government sensitivity trainings we go through, that's probably what makes me neurotic about it. You say one thing that even remotely looks like a race issue and it's big trouble.

Yeah...we had to attend them on a yearly basis when I was in the Army......what a waste of time. Once yes.......every year ???? C'mon !

Steve

[peace_baby]

I'm not sure color blind is really the right goal, unless the goal is to cease to be different, and evolve into this sortof generic uni-race. Do you think the man should be embarrassed that he's Asian? Seriously! Is it ~insulting~ in any way that a caucasian drives a truck? Why would it be embarrassing or insulting for one of the players here to be Asian? Race is not a social disease, it's a description. ;)

What about a white man (republican) that drives a Toyota pickup truck? :p

[WashingtonBay]

What about a white man (republican) that drives a Toyota pickup truck? :p

With or without the peeing?:p

[peace_baby]

With or without the peeing?:p

Lol without.

[WashingtonBay]

Ah - prolly one of those wishy-washy moderate republicans then ;)

[peace_baby]

Ah - prolly one of those wishy-washy moderate republicans then ;)

Ohhh okay. Yeah that makes sense. :)

[cheval]

Ours is twice a year. And neurotic or not, I'm not getting into any habits of referring to people by their race.

And quite frankly, like I said it's not necessary to define people by their race.

You're a man, you're a woman or you're a tool. It's pretty simple.

[Tatesgram]

Well, I've got to disagree. If you need to describe someone, what are you going to say "well it was a women..."? Do you know there was a study done on white people failing to describe black people? Black people actually found it offensive that whites refused to describe them as black or african american for fear of insulting them. Most black people I know, know they are black.

It was a test (wish I knew where to find that link now) where they asked white people to describe a suspect. If it was a white policeman, they would say it was a black man, wearing a green shirt, etc. If it was a black policeman, they would circle around the race thing. Not all, but a lot of people didn't want to offend. The black people had no problem describing the suspects, black or white.

I think we are getting way too PC, and I also think people look for reasons to be insulted. Just my :2cents:.

[WashingtonBay]

Why categorize them by gender either? I mean really... :D

[cheval]

Well, I've got to disagree. If you need to describe someone, what are you going to say "well it was a women..."?

I'm not sure what this means?

In this day and age you have to be careful because you can get yourself into trouble for the slightest hint of race issues! It would be nice if you didn't have to worry about it. Maybe it's not so much an issue outside of Government.

[Kaitlyn]

Wow, really sorry this is out of hand. I just thought it was giggle worthy..

[Arrow]

I don't think it got out of hand at all--it was a pretty interesting discussion, actually.:)

[peace_baby]

I'm not sure what this means?

I think she means if you have to describe the person to someone such as a police officer. Say for instance you witness someone breaking into another person's car and the police officer asks you to describe the person. You wouldn't just say what gender they are, you would have to describe the race also (or skin color) so that they know what to look for. "Man" or "Woman" is a far too broad category for them, they need specifics and race (plus gender) is a lot more specific.

ETA: We all know you would have to be more specific than gender and skin color when describing someone to the police in such a situation as I described, but you get the point.

[Kaitlyn]

Alright then, continue on..haha.

[WashingtonBay]

Wow, really sorry this is out of hand. I just thought it was giggle worthy..

Who knew you were the disruptive one getting everyone all stirred up! :D

I think it's an interesting discussion too. :)

[FlapJack]

Do you know there was a study done on white people failing to describe black people? Black people actually found it offensive that whites refused to describe them as black or african american for fear of insulting them.

That's a good point! I agree that people are afraid of not being PC about things. Just recently I was asked to describe someone for something and I was almost apprehensive to say 'black' for fear of sounding racist. It was kind of ridiculous of me but I think a lot of people feel that way.

[natisha]

Well, I consider this insulting to Indians--it perpetuates untrue stereotypes:

Women did all the work, Medicine man free. Indian man spend all day
hunting and fishing; all night having sex. Just wondering who the men spent all night having sex with?

[peace_baby]

Just wondering who the men spent all night having sex with?

Pfff.. :hysterical::whistle:

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

I see your point, but with our past history, race has been a bigger issue. I think you can still communicate a story without it. I don't say, my white male friend and I went to lunch or my white female friend and I are going to the movies this weekend. You go with a person, that should be good enough. JMO.

Bigger issue my foot. There isn't a single culture in this great big world of ours that doesn't have a history of slavery at some point. Not one. What we DO have is a culture that ENDED slavery... a practice I might add that still continues to this day in Africa and the middle east.

See... I simply carry no prior "race guilt" about slavery. My ancestors got here after that ended, though back in my history they (the Vikings) took slaves too. But those slaves were English. Then on the other half of my family history... they were the English slaves that were dragged back to Norway. So I figure I break out more or less even on the guilt-complex for this one.

[Kaitlyn]

Rd - you should sue for millions for your ancestors being slaves... :hysterical:

[cheval]

You have your view. I have mine. And mine is to step lightly so I don't loose my damn job. I've seen plenty of people get into to trouble because someone that was not white (take your pick race-wise - but the examples I'm thinking are actually middle-eastern) took offense at what 'seemed' like a non-issue.

[HoustonFarrier]

.....And mine is to step lightly so I don't loose my damn job. .

Yep....I can't blame you one bit. It's a shame it's like that...but..that is the country we have created.

Steve